[virtual-rj]

update. wife took it to the range today. (range day with her co-irkers).

they all like it, and it has not budged. and the red dot is still holding zero.

but the muzzle is missing something, it just looks kinda plain.

 

[3wbdriver]

Overall I like the setup, though a smaller Aimpoint may make more sense than the Eotech. I still like the Eotech reticle though, even if my eyes are changing and starting to blur/cluster the recticle. I have very good vision otherwise and don't know if its astigmatism. I was told something else causes this as well but I can't recall what it was.

Travis, Eotech has a new model out that uses a CR123 battery inserted crosswise in the front. It looks like yours without the long nose. I almost bought one for $400 at Academy Sports a couple weeks ago but they were down to just the display model and unwilling to give a discount for that.

http://www.eotech-inc.com/product.php?id=30&cat=4

 

[lab-rat]

I have the Eotech XPS2-0 on mine and really like it (see my pictures on page 1 or 2 of this post). I finely had to replace the 123 battery after having the unit for more than a year.

 

[tesset79]

The XPS2 looks like it would work much better. I'm kind of leary buying the newer Eotechs. I heard some models have what seems to be reccurring problems and I forget which ones do and which ones don't. Mostly severe battery drain even when turned off. I do remember the 551 with the N batteries seemed to be the worst as far as battery drain. The one in the pics is an older 551 (i believe Rev E), has the slightly bubbled out buttons and not the rubber ones. Its pretty old but it still works well and holds zero. It doesn't have the battery drain issue either. Battery life is only around 200 hrs at mid setting, the XPS2 looks to be rated at 600. It also appears the XPS2 only needs 1 battery where the 551 takes 2. The biggest thing I like about the XPS2 is its side battery access. If you look at the setup in the pics, the 551 would need removed to change batteries because the front sight is blocking the compartment. It repeats around 1 Moa when remounted though if replaced in original position and torqued down consistently. I'm interested in Aimpoint's new model they just came out with. I have a Comp M thats ancient and still going strong. The new model is the Pro, here's the link
http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=2561
Battery life isn't as good as some of their models but still very good at around 3yrs at 7 setting. Comes with a QRP2 mount as well which is supposed to be a pretty good mount. One negative is some said the glass isn't as good as other Aimpoints and it has a blueish tint to it but I've haven't handled one yet myself. Looks interesting anyways.

 

[Tron1]

Travis,

How about something like this, with a flip-up front sight mounted on a shorter, non-rotating extension of the original forend? You could mount a laser and a flashlight on either side and a bipod below.

Or, the same forend with a rail that extends almost to the hinge nut? You could mount a lensatic scope closer to your eye.

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain! Nor to the SOCOM stock; I just like the look.

Tron1

 

[jmartin]

Um yeah the first site popped up by google had them..I even checked sportsmansguide and they have this model and another one from CAA that is similar then the ultimate version from Mako that folds and has the tactical light slot built in.  There are two versions of the EMA grip..3 or 5 position and the CAA is similar but slightly cheaper.  The Mako runs in the 70s but has the light slot.

Always check sportsmansguide..they didnt show up on the google list but they are a good place to start with and with the club you get a 10% discount.  They also like to give out free shipping or $10 off coupons routinely to club members.  Last year they gave out a $25 gift card if you spent over $100 dollars right before Christmas.

On a side note...they have a sister site called bargainoutfitters.com.  YOU can often get the same stuff but they like do make their deals when you spend over $49 so on some things they are the better deal.

Um, no...it's not the same one. I found plenty of the '3-position' and '5-position'...I want the '2-position' - up or down...and most of the other ones (like at sportsmansguide) look like crap.

- I'll wait till the one I want is available (or till something else better comes along...)

 

[Cobraeye]

now that second pic with the rail extending back to the hinge nut, that would be more compatable with scope optics. Any of you owners of this forearm see why the rail that far back would interfere with anything. If not I think I may order tomorrow.

 

[Tron1]

Cobraeye,

I put the longer rail in the bottom drawing all the way to the hinge nut precisely for that -- to provide a platform for a lensatic scope -- that would allow the eyepiece to be situated closer to the eye of the firer. If you were to use a high scope mount, the eyepiece would probably clear the hinge assembly, but only if the rear sight were modified to lie flat against the receiver. There is a description of how to modify the rear sight in the F.A.Q. section. Apparently, it is a simple procedure, one that involves merely "clipping" the small tabs on either side of the sight itself.

Here is the address:

http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1204509726

In my opinion, at least four things should be considered before installing this long a rail:

First, approximately five inches of rail will be "free floating". There would probably be some vibration between the first shot and subsequent ones.
Second, you can not forget to rotate the forend before folding; otherwise, you would run the risk of damaging the*scope. You have to rotate it regardless of what you mount; there will be hardly any space between the forend and the bolt tube once the rifle is folded, which is why one side of the forend has no rail.
Third, you will probably have to adjust your cheekweld when resting your cheek on the bolt tube, due to the increased height of the scope eyepiece.
Fourth, if you use German Torque Specification "Gutentight" (Pronounced, "Good-n-tight"; ) on the knurled nut, remember that you will not have the entire nut to grab when loosening it for indexing or folding.

Remember, though, this is just my opinion (and opinions are just like elbows, most people have at least one ).

Also, remember that the forend extention upon which I drew the front sight does not exist; it is only a fig newton of my imagination. So, do not try to order one from [highlight]Red Lion Precision, LLC[/highlight]! *;D If the idea of this extension catches on, maybe they would consider building it.

If you do order the forend, please do not forget to post some pictures when it arrives, both here and in the "Sub porn pictures" thread.

Best wishes.

Tron1

 

[molonlabe]

Ah my mistake..I assumed that all EMA products would be of equal quality not just the one you wanted. The three and five positions grips on SG are EMA and they also have Mako brand which has a good rep.

Further down on the list you can see a listing for Trading post supply..they have/had 115 in stock according to their site for less than $30. Shipping to NC was a bit steep at over $11 for a part that will ship in a priority mail bag.

A place called the country shed has the best site for seeing pics of the various grips but they dont have this particular EMA grip.

 

[Cobraeye]

Tron1

First of all I have to figure out how to say this, you have a very eloquint way of expressing yourself. I appreciate all of your input to the forum. I have already done the rear sight mod. Picked up a little butane torch for the front sight. This is my second sub 2000. I have no problem modifying guns. In fact reloading and target shooting is what I do.
My sub 2000's are the coolest little guns I own. However two heart attacks and a leg amputation limits my mobility somewhat. So have patience with the pics. I am pretty sure I am ordering this forearm today but am still looking for input from others.

Cobraeye

 

[tesset79]

I'd like to have your talent with photoshop Tron. I could display my ideas alot better. The picatinny rail that close to the forend locking nut would need a different height/thickness along with a relief cut out as the coupler (clamping hardware must be cleared as well) and nut is higher than the rail contact surface. Basically, you need to get about .225" above the flat on the forend that the picatinney rail bolts onto. Anything that does not go below the top of the forend's picatinney rail when extended back over the knurled nut and coupler should work. It may also hinder loosening the nut as well because you would not be able to grip it in this area. I used a scope and clipping the rear sight to fold it when in the firing position is almost a must. I used some really high rings I had with a 1-4 shotgun scope and it worked but it wasn't ideal. I think something like these may work well depending on the scope. But I'd have to try them out to be sure. A scout scope may be a good option as well.

Here a link with more info on the parts in the pics.
http://www.yankeehillmachine.com/store/rails.html

 

[Tron1]

Cobraeye,

Thank you for the compliment; I do not deserve it, for I merely attempt to express myself politely. As for my contributions to the Forum, you are quite welcome. I am very pleased that my ramblings have been of some use.

So, you have two Sub2000s? Then, Sir, you are doubly blessed; there are those of us who still have yet to own our first.

Please allow me to offer my deepest sympathies. I truly hope your health and mobility improve enough for you to enjoy your rifles for many years to come.

As I said to our fine moderator, 3wbdriver, in Reply #8 of this thread, "I am a patient person, with more spare time than I need. I can wait for someone to post a review." And, in your case, I can also wait for some pictures.

-------

tesset79 (Travis),

Hello! And welcome to the Forum! I just knew you would hear about this little discussion of your fine product. Allow me to congratulate you on this item. It has caused quite a stir!

Thank you also for your praise of my "talent". I must clarify one thing: I do not have PhotoShop, nor any other picture editing software outside of Windows Paint. Yes, the same one that is on most of our Windows-equipped computers. The only skill I have is patience. That, and pestering others to provide me with the media for my alterations.

About the extended rail: If you notice, between the "free floating" section of rail and the knurled nut and coupler I drew a small gap. I took into consideration the difference in diameter of these parts in comparison to the forend mounting surface when I drew the composite picture. I attempted to "shave" from the bottom of the "free floating" section twice the difference in height from the forend mounting surface to the coupler, which I thought was higher than the knurled nut. I used the picture below as a reference:

The clamp portion of the picatinny rail used on the Red Lion forend appeared sufficiently high in order to remove the aforementioned difference without compromising its integrity. But, what do I know? I only used pictures! * Like this one:

From what I could see, the sight clamp sits high on the rail. This is why I presumed shaving the bottom of it would be possible. But, like I said, I only drew from pictures; I don't have the benefit of a real forend.

Maybe you can change that sometime in the near future? *

Tron1

 

[Cobraeye]

Well I finally threw down and purchased the red lion forend, I think unlike Tron1 I am not a patient person, also the part on the website that said or until supply runs out sort scared me into my purchase. Anyway the stuff should be here next week.

 

[Tron1]

Cobraeye,

Congratulations.  

Tron1

 

[Cobraeye]

By the way Tron1 I retired from the Air Force in 1995. I presume you served from your picture.

 

[Tron1]

Cobraeye,

Roger that, 13 years active duty, US Army. Medically discharged in 2002, due to consequences arising from a Howitzer accident in '98 and surgeries in '01 and '02.

Tron1

 

[rjpsb1]

The Red Lion forend arrived a couple of days ago.  Tonight I had time to assemble it.

I've tried the factory forend, the 1st generation Kel-Tec quad rail, and a bunch of cheap NCStar barrel mount quad rails.  They're all pretty lame.

The Red Lion forend blows me away.  Brilliant.  I can't wait to get it out to the range.


Thank you,
Robert

 

[bobkt]

I assembled my Red Lion Indexing Forend and started to install some accessories.

Note: the Keltec front sight is not permanently attached. It sits there by friction only. I wanted to visualize what it would look like.


Tron1,

I am seeking a replacement for it and the rear sight. I like the rear sight solution designed by MajorPandemic http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1298005807.  Thank you sir!

Then the front could be a Blue Force Gear variant (so that we retain the original locking feature) with control for elevation only, and with the addition of a necessary 1/2 X 28  threaded extension up front (for suppressors, silencers, flash hiders, etc) and the picatinny rail at the bottom (for bipod, folding handle, laser, etc). I am going to draw it up this week and will post it.

Tron1, would that generate enough interest? Enough that one of our KTOG excellent designer/manufacturer can produce it for us! Comments and Feedback please!

The sight is an inexpensive red/green dot sight found at Walmart http://www.walmart.com/ip/CenterPoint-1x34mm-Quick-Aim-Sight/10248650[/url].

I elevated it about 1" using the UTG 1-Inch High 13-slot Hi-profile Full Size Riser Mount, purchased from Amazon.

Now I can see over the Keltec front and rear sights.

There is a tri-rail near the front sight and a bipod.

I will be testing this arrangement next.

I have two more picatinny rails on order with Red Lion and will be installing the flashlight and handle next.

That plastic pink THING is got to go right?

The Flashlight is UTG model ZL337

The Foldable Foregrip is UTG Model 15 Ambidextrous

The Bipod is by UTG bought from Amazon: UTG Bipod, SWAT/Combat Profile, Adjustable Height, Rubberized Stand

20110311

Bobkt

 

[kwikrnuwife]

My husband receive his today.

He is going to cut the barrel down to 11 inches and put on a liberty brand mystic silencer. Here is the fixed barel mount for the silencer which seems to fit perfectly.

 

[maswell]

The height from center of bore to the top of picatinny rail on the forend is 1.125 inches. Standard AR15 front sights mounted on the R6 rail are too high to use with the factory rear and windage would be a luck of the draw thing being as they have none.

Have you looked at the Magpul MBUS backup sights?  From what i've read they sit lower than most of the other AR rail sights -- people with AR-15s have been having to raise the post a ton to get a center shot (see pic).  It's cheap, sturdy, and might actually sit low enough to work.  Doesn't fix the windage issue, though someone could produce something along the lines of majorpandemics rear adjustable and fix that issue (if it is even needed).  http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1298005807

Just a thought.