"You never used to click before!!!"

Discussion in 'P-3AT' started by Birdsbeaks, May 10, 2009.

  1. Birdsbeaks

    Birdsbeaks New Member

    12
    May 10, 2009
    Hello KTOG,

    I just want to start off by saying that this community is an amazing resource! This is my first post (apologies, because it'll probably be a long one...), but I've been lurking around and reading since before i purchased a new P3AT a few weeks ago.  I've been googling non-stop to try to find a solution, and when just about every search led me to this forum, I began using the forum's search function to  try to find a fix for the issue (if it is an issue at all, that is), in hope that I could fix myself, without having to make the classic (and redundant) "HELP!!!" noob post for a solution that has already been explained.  Since I started this topic, it's clear i was not successful.  Please forgive if this question has already been answered and I happened to miss it somehow. Thanks.

    So...

    When I first purchased this piece I was a little surprised (yet thrilled), that it performed flawlessly right out of the box.    Took it out to the range for a break in, not one malfunction of any kind in 200 rounds.  In fact, the gun has still had no malf of any kind besides one FTF, which i'm positive was due to limpwristing.  

    So, a friend of mine was so impressed with my new piece that he decided to pick one up too.  He had problems from the word "go".  Failures to feed, failures to fire, light strikes, and a weird clicking sound at the end of the trigger pull, that coincided with the hammer not falling properly.  When we took it apart to check it out, we noticed that the hammer block was snagging on a roll pin in the hammer that appeared to be improperly oriented.  After the roll pin was repositioned the clicking at the end of the trigger pull ceased and the hammer began dropping properly and reliably (i noticed afterwards while searching that two members of this board in Montana had what sounds like the same problem with the roll pin). A  FnB took care of the feeding issues and cutting a couple coils off the firing pin spring (i've read varied opinions on this, but for the problem i've got it's inconsequential) resolved the light strikes.  His P3AT now seems to function flawlessly.  :)

    Now, the only slight problem i had was that when firing HP's, unless i racked the slide very aggressively, the slide would not come forward and chamber the round.  After observing how smoothly my friend's gun fed HP's after the polishing of the feed ramp during the FnB, I decided to do the same.  I suppose I should have left well enough alone, but I figured since I already had the piece disassembled, I ought to go ahead and do a thorough FnB.  I polished the feed ramp, outside of the barrel, slide rails, sides (but not the groove) and the inside of the cut out of the trigger bar, all with 1000 - 1500 grit polishing cloths.  At the end, everything looked great and felt smooth.  I also took some 600 grit sandpaper and removed some of the excess plastic around the trigger well and all the way around the inside of the trigger guard. Also smoothed out the seam on the front of the trigger, at the end everything felt and looked great.

    THE PROBLEM: When I put the piece back together, i now have a click at the end of my trigger pull when the hammer is down.  Even though the gun seems to function normally, and it doesn't appear to effect the operation of the hammer (as it did on my friend's gun), I still find it troublesome that it is clicking now, when it never did before, and for the life of me i cant come up with a good explanation or fix for it.  I've checked the orientation of the roll pin and it isn't that, however just to be on the safe side and completely eliminate it as a factor, i repositioned it.  It does not click if the hammer is all the way down and the slide is off, however, if i manually cock the hammer and let it fall, but not all the way (about to the position it would be in if the slide were on, I can make it make the clicking sound and observe the hammer block moving slightly forward and then falling back onto the hammer pin ( the source of the clicking as far as i can tell). Also, it appears to never make the click on the trigger pull that actually drops the cocked hammer.  It only begins to click on subsequent pulls of the trigger.

    Any ideas on why it's clicking now and not before, if it's normal or not, and how to make it quit doing it, would be much appreciated.  I've taken it apart about twenty times now, no exaggeration.  No success. I'm pulling my hair out. HELP!!!  :(
     
  2. Birdsbeaks

    Birdsbeaks New Member

    12
    May 10, 2009
    Further observation reveals that the clicking may be the trigger bar slapping against the side of the frame. I don't know! Ideas?
     

  3. TxCajun

    TxCajun Administrator Staff Member Supporter

    Sep 7, 2004
    Texas
    I have seen this before and IIRC it usually results from a bent or mishaped trigger bar.  I don't imagine you removed much metal from the trigger bar with 1000 grit paper so I don't know what the deal is.  Put it on a flat surface and check it out.  Is it straight?  If nothing else, call KT service and ask for a new trigger bar.[reason]typo[/reason]
     
  4. Birdsbeaks

    Birdsbeaks New Member

    12
    May 10, 2009
    hmmm... installed a new trigger bar from a friend of mine's P3 that doesn't click.
    Mine still clicks even with the new bar.

    Probably take it out to the range tomorrow and see if it effects performance. Seems stupid to even consider sending a fully functioning pistol back to KT for something that is essentially cosmetic. Plus, I want to know why it's clicking as much as I want it to quit it.

    Wondering now if it has something to do with the trigger mechanism, or possibly the hammer block.

    Is there any way to remove the trigger, trigger pin, trigger axis and spring?
    I haven't seen any instructions for that in any of the disassembly guides.

    Thinking about adding the trigger stop mod, which would indirectly solve the problem i suppose... :(
     
  5. TxCajun

    TxCajun Administrator Staff Member Supporter

    Sep 7, 2004
    Texas
    You actually must break the trigger on the P3s to change them. I'd call KT service and talk to a tech. They probably know what the click is and can advise you.
     
  6. Moose

    Moose New Member

    257
    Jun 22, 2005
    Thanks, that's good to know.
    Now I won't try to remove it, as I usually take things completely apart.
     
  7. PshootR

    PshootR Banned

    Apr 1, 2005
    To function test the trigger on any Kel-Tec P-32, P3-AT or PF-9 I would dry fire the pistol after making absolutely certain that it is not loaded and then without ever letting go of the trigger or allowing it to move forward at all completely cycle the slide and then fully release the trigger and press it again. This simulates the actual firing sequence of the pistol.

    You can also, after checking that the piece is unloaded, drop a standard wood pencil with a good eraser down the barrel eraser end first and fire the pistol straight up. The pencil should "shoot" about 2 feet into the air if it is well struck by the firing pin.

    Warning: Failure to check that your gun is not loaded can result in your ruining a perfectly good pencil! ;)
     
  8. Birdsbeaks

    Birdsbeaks New Member

    12
    May 10, 2009
    I'd read that about breaking the trigger in a p32 disassembly guide, wasnt sure if it also applied to the P3AT. thanks.

    Passes both of the function tests just fine.

    'bout to head out to the range.

    Suppose i'll give KT a call later and see what they think. Thanks for the suggestions!
     
  9. mr_camera_man

    mr_camera_man New Member

    28
    Mar 27, 2009
    The P3AT I bought a few weeks ago does this, and I've never had it apart beyond a field strip. It functions 100%, though. The first-gen P32 I had did not have this click
     
  10. Birdsbeaks

    Birdsbeaks New Member

    12
    May 10, 2009
    Took it out to the range yesterday.

    ~50 rounds of Blazer FMJ aluminum case (all we can find round here, and it looks like that's dried up too, except for: http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1242022417 :eek: )

    No malfs of any kind.

    Still clickin' away.

    Thinking I should probably just get over it and keep my danged finger off the trigger! lol!

    Still considering giving KT a call and asking if they've heard of this before and if there's a fix. Not really considering sending it back to the mothership for something so inconsequential... seems like it would kinda be a cop out, too. I'll definitely post a solution if I ever figure it out.
     
  11. Birdsbeaks

    Birdsbeaks New Member

    12
    May 10, 2009
    You know, I was thinking about it, while watching the trigger bar engage the hammer block, that when I FnB'd, I used a real fine grit sandpaper to smooth out the inside rear of the trigger guard.

    Now I'm thinking that what small fraction of material was removed during buffing was what was preventing some trigger over travel, which is now making a click.

    Looks like I'm gonna go with an improvised trigger stop.

    I tested putting various things behind the trigger, and something as thin as the allen wrench that comes with the belt clip was enough to prevent it from clicking.

    I suppose that's a solution of sorts...
     
  12. billjohnso20

    billjohnso20 Active Member

    Dec 7, 2008
    Let us know what you use for your trigger stop. We'd love to see some pics as well. If nothing else the TS will help you with accuracy. It did for me.
     
  13. foundatown

    foundatown New Member

    120
    Aug 14, 2009
    Did you ever concretely diagnose the cause of the click? I'm having the same problem after buying my P-3AT just a few hours ago.

    I field stripped it, but didn't realize it should have been in a semi-cocked state before I took it down (The manual is atrocious at explaining this.), and in order to place it in a semi-cocked state I had to manually pull back the hammer, but not after trying once and having it slip on me farther forward than it should have gone.

    I, too, didn't recall hearing this click when I was checking the pistol out at the store.

    I'm not very happy about this noise, as it indicates to me some sort of misalignment.
     
  14. XsYang

    XsYang New Member

    98
    Jun 24, 2009
    Since your friend has the same gun, can you switch one part at a time from his gun to see if you can pinpoint which part is causing the problem?