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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, I am new to this forum and also new to the KT sub 2000, 40 cal.

First let me say that this is a fascinating little weapon....I love the concept of the rifle but.....I am struggling to get my head down low enough to get my eye on the sight especially with ears on. When I do the recoil kicks the crap out of my face. I know I can get the rubber cover for it and will.

My question is...is there a better way to get a good sight picture without sacrificing my face lol.

I had fun with it today...out of the box ran 4 31 round mags with out a single failure other than my face and shoulder!
 

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I had recently bought a sub 2000 also. it came with tandemcross rubber piece. ( say goodby to adjusting LOP )Get a red dot with tall mount. I have an aimpoint compM2 with mine other wise shoulder the stock good and put your cheek at an angle. Good luck!
 

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These things are pretty much impossible to shoot with muff style hearing protection. Try it with just plugs. Pull the stock firmly into your shoulder to prevent face slap., then lay your cheekbone down on the tube and roll your face forward and in so your nose is just touching the forward collar on the tube. This should bring your eye down and in so the rear sight is in alignment.
 

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I agree with 3wbdriver's post above (good advice).

However, I just cannot get comfortable using the original sights. They are way too low for me to shoot the Sub 2000 carbines and enjoy it.

My Gen 1 had the original sights removed a long time ago. A TRS-25 red dot, on a riser, on a Red Lion fore end, is now the only sight on my Gen 1. I turn the sight on low and leave it on. So far, the batteries have lasted more than 6 months at a time and are still functioning. I don't know how long they will actually last as I change them at 6 month intervals (they are cheap). I never have to worry about turning on the sight in a hurry or in the dark. Its always on. I truly enjoy shooting my Gen 1 with the red dot only.

I just recently got my Gen 2. At 3 AM this morning, I removed the rear sight and fore end. As soon as I get my morning chores done, I am going to remove the front sight. I had to wait until daylight as I have no heat or working light in my barn where my vise is. I will reassemble the Gen 2 without sights and use only a red dot on it also.

I have the Tacticool rubber covers on my butt stocks. I am not sure they reduce felt recoil, but they do insulate my cheek from freezing cold and blistering heat, which is a good thing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for the advice! I am going to try each of these from least expensive and may have to go to the Red Lion to get it up and running for me.

I have to stick with the muffs, I can stand anything sticking in my ear....and I spent way to much on my ear protection. I hope KT can rethink their sights. You shouldn't have to make big changes to get on the sights.

I'm hard headed I will makes this work for me....thanks again
 

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I have the same problem as well. Since there are no extra tall rear sight on the market, so I attempted to make one out of steel bar stock with drill press and hand files.

The first one I made was way too high, with extra tall front sight post, my zero is still way off, so I made a second shorter one. Haven't taken it out to the range yet, but with laser bore sight, it ought to zero okay around 30 - 50 yrds or so.
 

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Thanks for the advice! I am going to try each of these from least expensive and may have to go to the Red Lion to get it up and running for me.

I have to stick with the muffs, I can stand anything sticking in my ear....and I spent way to much on my ear protection. I hope KT can rethink their sights. You shouldn't have to make big changes to get on the sights.

I'm hard headed I will makes this work for me....thanks again
You don't have to go to the Red Lion. Just remove the front and rear sights (they are just an annoyance when using the red dot) and put them in storage (easily done - I took mine off today in less than 2 minutes) and mount an inexpensive red dot (I have seen them online for as little as $19.95 in the last week) on the top Picatinny rail of the plastic fore end. Some red dots come with risers, but you can get them in 1/2", 3/4", and 1" heights to bring the red dot up to the height you are comfortable with.

Once you have a working combination, you can use it as a base for upgrading as desired.

Also, I can't deal with anything stuck in my ear. I used to use big muffs. They were the only ones available. About 2 years ago, I bought a set of very thin muffs. They are just as good, if not better than the big ones.
 

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I have thin muffs also. But the sub isn't so loud. So I usually end up with just plugs.
As for removing the rear sight, check the FAQ.
There is a free mod that takes 2 seconds to make your factory sight a folding rear sight.
If I made a taller one, I would want it to fold also.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
After 40 years of shooting I found ears I really like.....I am going to try to make the weapon work for me and not have to work for it....if that makes since. I have 3 other assault rifles and a a few long guns as well as a bunch of hand guns....so this little sub 2000 is going to work. Haha.

The longer or taller sights would be a good idea and I think that's a great way to go but I don't have my machine tools anymore so back to trying all the ideas you guys a have suggested.....except the change of ears....did I mention I was hard headed!

Thanks so much for all the help.
 

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Last night I shot my S2k after I follow the FAQ about how to clip the wings on the rear sights. works wonders! I shot at 7-10 yards and with the rear sight folded down its great. try it!
 

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Last night I shot my S2k after I follow the FAQ about how to clip the wings on the rear sights. works wonders! I shot at 7-10 yards and with the rear sight folded down its great. try it!
So, you are using just the front sight?
Yes the sub is pretty easy to point and shoot.
The flip down sight is usually used when using a scope. I would be interested in how you shoot like that at 25, 50, 75...
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I took some advise and tried again today using ear plugs. Much easier to get the sight where I needed it and was on at 25 yards and in. It is still kicking the crap out of my face....I feel like I went a couple rounds with Mike Tyson.lol.

I am not sure which direction I'm going to go with this weapon.....upgrade it, lion head and do something to help with the check recoil or just move on from it?

It really needs a cheek rest on it. I just love the concept of this gun, perfect idea for a truck gun but when you start upgrading it your at the price of a inexpensive AR...except the AR won't fold as easy��
 

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Can you get someone to take a picture of you holding it in your shooting stance? Preferably from the right side?
 

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I think the sights just need to be taller, I first mounted my red dot on a taller high rise that covered the irons, giving me a half cheek/half chin weld. Very comfortable and repeatable. But I'd added a KNS crosshair front sight post and didn't want to cover it up so I dropped the red dot down to a lower 1/3 co-witness. I had some heavy adhesive backed felt that I wrapped around the buffer tube which helped but for me it's just the shape of the buffer. And I have no problem using a bare bones M4 stock on an AR with irons.

I thought about the Tacticool buffer tube cover but it looked thick and making the tube bigger would just make my issue worse.
 

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Oh, someone mentioned it but the company Tacticool makes a slip on cover for the receiver. Not only that, they make just what you need to not only protect your face, but also a buffer to mitigate recoil, and a charging handle cover that makes it easier to use.

Also Keltec sells a heavier bolt, with members here reporting good results in the .40.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
After thinking about it here is my suggestion....

1. The sights need to be taller
2. A cheek rest would help a lot
3. Put the heaver bolt to help with the recoil of the .40
4. Maybe the Red Lion if taller sight cannot be located

Now these are just my suggestion for me and not have to have equipment. The weapon shoots just fine, zero malfunctions through about 200 rounds....other than my face.lol

My issue is simple, to make the rifle work for me I am looking at heavy bolt, tube cover, RedLion indexing front, AimPoint or similar. That will run the cost of the weapon up pretty high....so should I spend the cash and make it work for me or sell it and put the cash in another AR platform??????
 

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After thinking about it here is my suggestion....

1. The sights need to be taller
2. A cheek rest would help a lot
3. Put the heaver bolt to help with the recoil of the .40
4. Maybe the Red Lion if taller sight cannot be located

Now these are just my suggestion for me and not have to have equipment. The weapon shoots just fine, zero malfunctions through about 200 rounds....other than my face.lol

My issue is simple, to make the rifle work for me I am looking at heavy bolt, tube cover, RedLion indexing front, AimPoint or similar. That will run the cost of the weapon up pretty high....so should I spend the cash and make it work for me or sell it and put the cash in another AR platform??????
The question is does the sub fill the role you intended?
What the sub brings is it is THE folding pistol caliber carbine. It is reasonably accurate,far more accurate than a handgun. It doesn't replace a rifle rather it is a low powered carbine that can be carried discreetly when a rifle would be out of the question. What it is not is a target/ bench gun, long range gun or a ergonomic comfortable weapon.
Unless the folding aspect is important from a logistical stand point you may be better served by other platforms IMHO. Some folks love to mess around and add bells and whistles, to each their own...but there are other guns that will yield better results rather than trying to make the sub into that which it is not.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
The question is does the sub fill the role you intended?
What the sub brings is it is THE folding pistol caliber carbine. It is reasonably accurate,far more accurate than a handgun. It doesn't replace a rifle rather it is a low powered carbine that can be carried discreetly when a rifle would be out of the question. What it is not is a target/ bench gun, long range gun or a ergonomic comfortable weapon.
Unless the folding aspect is important from a logistical stand point you may be better served by other platforms IMHO. Some folks love to mess around and add bells and whistles, to each their own...but there are other guns that will yield better results rather than trying to make the sub into that which it is not.
The concept fit the role, truck gun and perhaps a backpack. It is the folding function that intrigued me. I already own a few guns....Ar-15, AR-10 300 Blackout and more pistols than I can carry, I love the idea of a collapsible carbine. I have added a little something to every weapon I own so this may be what I have to do to make it work for me.

I will say this the sub is as dependable as any weapon I own and I have some high dollar guns. Would I use this if my life depended on it...hell yes I would! I shoot a lot and this is accurate and so far dependable, maybe even more than some I own.

The problem is the dang sights being to low. If they would come up with an upgrade for that and maybe cheek rest I would buy another one.
 
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