[daisy]

I was very excited to purchase Lehigh 32 auto 50gr Xtreme Cavitator ammo.

However, after my first two shots, I experienced rim lock. Never experienced that before with P32 and ball ammo. Has anyone experienced this with Lehigh and, if so, how did you resolve this? Before this, I knew my P32 would ALWAYS go bang when I pulled the trigger.

Thanks!

 

[JMag1]

Nope; hasn't happened with me and my gen 1 P32.

 

[TxCajun]

Ammo below a given OAL requires a simple mag mod to prevent rimlock. KT used to sell one but I couldn't find it on their site. You might call them , but they are closed til the 5th. Frankly, just make a simple Flyer Wire:

http://www.1bad69.com/keltec/flyerwire.htm

 

[haugrdr]

They don't sell them anymore, Tx.

 

[TxCajun]

Figures, but no big deal. Flyer wire works fine and is more or less free if you can scrounge up the piece of wire.

 

[joemsj51]

Daisy
Is this P32 a Gen-2 gun you have?

If so, this is sad news to read here. I WAS interested in the Cavitator until I saw this thread.

I am not of any group that doctors or customizes magazines or handgun innards, to get ammo to work correctly. If it doesn't work out-of-the-box, then the wifey will remove the Cavitator from her Christmas Day Want-List. I'll see to that!

In the meantime, Fiocchi FMJ 73's is what's currently prescribed for her gun as her everyday defense-carry.

 

[TxCajun]

Another solution (compromise) is to load a JHP into the chamber, with one JHP on top of the mag. The remaining rounds are loaded with FMJ. In this configuration, no 2 JHP rounds are touching in the mag and rimlock cannot occur. Your first 2 rounds are JHP with the remainder being FMJ. You have hedged your bet, so to speak.

Joe - it does not matter which generation P32 one has. Rimlock is not just a KT issue but can happen with just about any 32 acp pistol loaded with shorter rounds. Seecamp is a counter-example. They built their mags to be shorter (front-to-back) to accommodate the shorter Win Silvertip JHP for which the gun was developed. With the shorter mags, the rounds are kept in position and rimlock cannot occur. The downside is that longer FMJ rounds will not fit in the mag and cannot be used.

Rimlock prevention kits or Flyer wires are not much of a modification and are used in other brands of pistol mags as well. With a flyer wire, you simply slide the follower back a little, insert the wire, then slide the follower back in place. They are easily inserted and/or removed. Some users would take a handful mags and put the Flyer wire in some, but leave others unchanged for use with FMJ rounds at the range.

When I regularly carried a P32, eventually I went with the "mixed loading" described in paragraph one. Many, although I don't personally subscribe to the theory, believe that FMJ rounds are always more effective than JHP in 32 acp, and resolve the issued by using only FMJ rounds. Be aware that there are a couple of FMJ rounds that are short enough (OAL) to rimlock. Somewhere lately in this forum, someone posted info on OALs that will and will
not rimlock, with a list rounds (brands).

 

[midmofly]

I visited Underwood Ammo Extreme Cavitator" and "Lehigh Extreme
Cavitators" sights and got the following info:
1) Lehigh

• 
  
  
  • Cartridge: 32 Auto
  • Bullet weight 50
    
    • Velocity (fps): 925
    • OAL (in): .945
    • Penetration (in): 13.5
    • Wound cavity (in): 1.5
    • *Patent Pending
      Note: Feeding Capabilities
      The list below will outline which 32 Auto's we tested the XC's in and which Guns we have been notified by our customers that there have been feeding concerns:
      Tested / Verified
      Berretta 32 Tomcat
      Kel-Tec P-32
      Noted Concerns
      Walther PP Manurhn 7.62
  • 2) Underwood
  • R.L. Reynolds May 12, 2017
    
    Yeah, I'd bet my life on it. I too own a Keltek 32, and it is real fussy with ammo. I always depended on Winchester Silvertips but I can never find them. I carry this as a back up or when I wear shorts and a T shirt. It is as minimum as you want to get, but you would still want it to be effective. Well I think I have found the solution. Nice recoil with the 32 ACP 50 Grain Xtreme Cavitator Very nice groupings on target. Interesting holes in target. I believe when the Underwood company says this would be very damaging to flesh. You could say they are pricey but it's not a target load and really what is your life worth. I ran 2 boxes through Less 8 for one loading, and will order more right away.

Dr. Fred March 9, 2015

feeds perfectly in my Keltec P32

Could this be an individual gun thing (ammo picky)?

 

[daisy]

So to answer the above...
- yes, it is a gen 2
- i also went to the mfg site and saw kel-tec was approved. that's why i was shocked when i had Rim Lock on third round
- i LOVE TxCajun's solution. I will have one cavitator in the pipe, one on top of the mag, then fiocchi, and one cavitator on the bottom. It makes a lot of sense and greatly increases my confidence. Or, if Tx Cajun thinks this makes sense, L, L, F, L, F, L, F, L

Kahr CM9/Kahr CW380/Keltec P32

Thanks to all!

 

[C-Ration]

I have a gen 2 P-32. I put 20 rounds of Underwood through it without an issue. Never had a feed issue of any kind with any ammo. I have never tested hollow points but never bothered since I don't plan on using them. I carry two mags loaded with Underwood in mine.

 

[daisy]

I have a gen 2 P-32. I put 20 rounds of Underwood through it without an issue. Never had a feed issue of any kind with any ammo. I have never tested hollow points but never bothered since I don't plan on using them. I carry two mags loaded with Underwood in mine.

Excellent. There was never a doubt I had rim lock. Pain unlocking the rims. I truly am glad you are not having problems. For my piece of mind, I am going to carry LLFLFLFL (L=Lehigh, F=Fiocchi). I hope I never have to use it for defense, but I think this ammo carry would leave them hurting. And as any P32 owner can confirm, you can fire 8 rounds in two seconds, all on target. I should clarify I'm talking about five yards. Full disclosure - I'm stating Lehigh when in fact I am using Underwood. Sorry if that caused any confusion.

 

[sfmccormick]

Excellent. There was never a doubt I had rim lock. Pain unlocking the rims. I truly am glad you are not having problems. For my piece of mind, I am going to carry LLFLFLFL (L=Lehigh, F=Fiocchi). I hope I never have to use it for defense, but I think this ammo carry would leave them hurting. And as any P32 owner can confirm, you can fire 8 rounds in two seconds, all on target. I should clarify I'm talking about five yards. Full disclosure - I'm stating Lehigh when in fact I am using Underwood. Sorry if that caused any confusion.

No offense, but I think you misunderstand the rimlock issue with short 32acp rounds. The short round (Lehigh in this case) is subject to slipping underneath any round above it in the magazine stack. A short round in the chamber and a short round on the top of the magazine stack is fine (as long as they otherwise feed in your pistol), but a short round anywhere deeper in the magazine stack is asking for rimlock.

 

[daisy]

No offense, but I think you misunderstand the rimlock issue with short 32acp rounds. The short round (Lehigh in this case) is subject to slipping underneath any round above it in the magazine stack. A short round in the chamber and a short round on the top of the magazine stack is fine (as long as they otherwise feed in your pistol), but a short round anywhere deeper in the magazine stack is asking for rimlock.

Ugh. I understand what you are saying. And that makes perfect sense. But even if I have all Lehigh, I still have the rimlock.

The only way I could be 100% sure of not having rimlock is to have the Lehigh in the chamber, and all Fiocchi in the mag? I am all thumbs when it would come to putting a guide wire in the mag.

Thanks!

 

[sfmccormick]

Ugh. I understand what you are saying. And that makes perfect sense. But even if I have all Lehigh, I still have the rimlock.

The only way I could be 100% sure of not having rimlock is to have the Lehigh in the chamber, and all Fiocchi in the mag? I am all thumbs when it would come to putting a guide wire in the mag.

Thanks!

As far as the rimlock issue, you should be fine with a short round in the chamber and a short round as the first round to feed out of the magazine. All the rest should be longer rounds like the Fiocchi.

 

[daisy]

As far as the rimlock issue, you should be fine with a short round in the chamber and a short round as the first round to feed out of the magazine. All the rest should be longer rounds like the Fiocchi.

TxCajun said the same thing (except last round also being Lehigh). I wonder why you both agree with first two being Lehigh. I understand the first round in the chamber. But wouldn't the top round in the mag have the potential to jump behind the second round in the mag? I apologize and am a novice. But I'm just trying to logically think this through. Thank you for your patience!

 

[sfmccormick]

I read TxCajun's post, but didn't see where he recommended the bottom round in the magazine to be a Lehigh?

The top round in the magazine can't jump behind the second round as long as the second round is a full length round like the Fiocchi FMJ. The 32acp is different than most semi-auto pistol cartridges in that it has a small rim with a diameter greater than the diameter of the cartridge body. If this rim slips over and behind the rim of the round below it in the magazine, the slide can't push the round forward into the chamber and you have rimlock.

A full length round like the Fiocchi FMJ doesn't leave enough room lengthwise in the P32 magazine for the rim of another round to slip behind it. A shorter length round like the Lehigh does leave enough room lengthwise in the P32 magazine for the rim of the round above it in the magazine to slip over and behind it and cause rimlock. So as long as you never have a shorter length round below any other round in the magazine, you won't have rimlock. The only way to never have a shorter length round below any other round in the magazine is to have the shorter length round as the top round and the top round only. Hope this helps.

 

[Matthias]

Hello all,

I experienced the rimlock issue with the Underwood Xtreme Cavitator 50gr +P out of my P32. I'm at about 250 rounds through the gun, of which 80 have been Xtreme Cavitators, the rest FMJ 73gr. I went through the first two boxes of Xtreme Cavitators with no issue (40 rounds), first time out ever shooting the gun (along with 50 rounds S&B, 50 Rounds Fiocchi) with no issues, no malfunctions. Second time out I shot another 50 rounds of Fiocchi without issue, switched to the Cavitators and got rim lock a couple different times with a couple different magazines. It was pretty difficult to get the mag out of the gun as well as work the rimlocked round out of the magazine after it happened. I like the idea of having one in the chamber, one on top of the mag, the rest of the mag being FMJ. After my first to boxes went through without issue I was ready to carry the Cavitators exclusively, but am thinking otherwise at the moment. I was able to get The rest of the Cavitators through after the fact but didn't save any for carry.
Perhaps my P32 isn't completely broken in, but I'm thinking any rim lock issues would be unrelated to break in. Will still likely buy another box, but again, just load up the chamber and top of the mag. Great forum, btw, learning a lot.

 

[FFocus]

Great give & take on our P-32 rimlock subject. Just through practical experience, one Cavitator+P in the pipe and one on top of mag over ball ammo is deffintely a SURE thing for EVERYDAY POCKET CARRY for each of my Three Gen 2 P-32 Katie's.

 

[midmofly]

Just a thought---has anyone compared the OAL of Lehigh and Underwood? Daisy's rimlock was with Underwood. In a past thread it was stated that rimlock would not happen if the ammo was .925 or longer---Lehigh states theirs as .945 and I have not found length on Underwood. Anyone know?
Gary

 

[sfmccormick]

Just a thought---has anyone compared the OAL of Lehigh and Underwood? Daisy's rimlock was with Underwood. In a past thread it was stated that rimlock would not happen if the ammo was .925 or longer---Lehigh states theirs as .945 and I have not found length on Underwood. Anyone know?
Gary

MRC over on the Seecamp forum obtained and tested some of the new .32 ACP ammo with the Xtreme Cavitator bullet from both Lehigh and Underwood. From his Seecamp's 2.06" barrel he obtained the following impressive results and all rounds functioned well. Velocities in a P32's 2.7" barrel should be a bit faster, I'd guess ~50 fps.

He measured both manufacturers' rounds OAL at .943, so perhaps these will not rimlock in P32's.

Lehigh Extreme Cavitators, Lehigh factory loads. 50 gr
979, 955, 978, 967, 918, 933, 905, 953, 950, 895 fps, - average 943 fps, - standard deviation 29, -KE 99 ft-lbs

Underwood Standard Pressure, Lehigh Extreme Cavitators 50 gr.
962, 982, 1013, 1036, 952, 1016, 1024, 1009, 1024, 962 fps, - average 998 fps, - standard deviation 30, -KE 111 ft-lbs

Underwood +P Lehigh Extreme Cavitator 50 gr.
1064, 1079, 1065, 1099, 1016, 1067, 1086, 1053, 1070, 1024 fps, -average 1062 fps, -standard deviation 25, -KE 125 ft-lbs

His full post is here http://www.seecamp.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1452905163/123#123

Don't have any to measure, but someone else measured both at .943 OAL.