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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Bought a 100 round box of Remington UMC 115 gr. Jacketed Hollow Points for my PF9 to eat last week and gave them a try this morn. It like's them. I declare it my ammo of choice for my PF9. Cheap enough to use as a range round. Effective enough as a self defense round. Good accuracy too. Best of both worlds IMHO.
Very pleased with the Rem's expansion both shooting in some wet phone books and some water jugs. Have tried the Rem UMC in other guns with marginal results, glad I gave the PF9 a chance with them. A bargain at less than 30 cents a round.
 

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The UMC JHP's aren't bad at all. Remington Express JHP's are almost identical, except they have sealed primers and lower-flash powder, but they cost like $40 for a box of 50.

Have you also taken a look at WWB JHP's or Winchester SXZ? They're both exactly the same as the ol' Winchester Silvertips. A bit more pricey than the UMC's, but they also perform very nicely and only cost about $20 (or less) for a box of 50, and the SXZ's have the Lubalox coating on them which supposedly makes for smoother feeding and cleaner shooting.
 

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They cheap Remingtons are my carry ammo in my PF9 as well. I would prefer Gold Dots but I'm in no rush at all to replace them.
 

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Thanks for the tip. I will try some. I have been using federal hi- shok which are rather cheap, have shot a hundred this weekend flawless.
 

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The Remington UMC 115Gr. JHP (L9MM1B) is an older design that doesn't have quite as much penetration or punch of some newer ammo (but still plenty enough for short range work in my judgement). The advantage of that older design is that it is more reliable in something like the PF-9 that may be a bit finicky in what it likes to shoot. That's why I've been using it as my standard carry round for the last couple of years.
 

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These are in mine as well. They do seem to shoot a little dirtier, though, and my gun gets finicky with them after a box or two if it's not cleaned in between them. A quick clean and lube gets the gun and ammo ready to play together again.
Incidentally, because of their availability and affordability, UMC JHPs also ride in my Bersa Thunder 380 and in my two four-inch .357 Magnum service revolvers (.38 Special +P SJHP in those.)
 

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I dunno bout you guys, but I just wouldn't feel comfortable trusting my life to a "bargain" round. Hornady CD rounds are inexpensive compared to some but seem to be a lot higher quality than those UMC...
 

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You can buy into the high dollar ammo if it makes you feel better. i think the biggest difference might just be the smaller box and the price.
 

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I happened to shoot some Fiocchi 40 S&W 180 grain JHPs at the same paper target that I had just shot my PF-9 at with the UMC/Remington 115 grain JHPs. The 40s (man they make big holes in the ground) just happened to dig up one the UMCs out of the dirt a few feet behind the target. The bullet was virtually only deformed by the barrel rifling and the nose wasn't even dented... I was really disappointed because it had shot so well... no failures, was as accurate as anything I've tried. I had even decided to make it my defense round, but now I've changed my mind. I ordered some 115 gr JHP and XT Fiocchi 9mm after I saw that. The JHP was only $19 - I hope they work well - anyone have experience with these?
 

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thats exactly why I don't trust the cheaper stuff. I have done a few "ballistic" tests of my own and didn't see much if any expansion on some of the cheaper JHP's if I hit someone I want it to do what its intended to do. Otherwise why not just stick with standard FMJ's?
 

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Those Remington hollowpoints are the ONLY ammo that has never had a misfire, FTF, FTE, etc. in my PF9. And that includes being judged against FMJ rounds. So the Remington hollowpoints are my carry round. The difference between these "old style" hollowpoints and newer ones is minimal (in regards to performance). However, there is a big price difference. There is no "magic bullet" no matter how the Gold Dots, Golden Sabres, Rangers, etc. make themselves out to be. Those new rounds might have a slight performance edge. Ephasis on slight. But for me, ultimate reliability trumps a slight performance edge every time.
 

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Digging a bullet out the ground is hardly scientific evidence of performance. If you are so worried about bullet expansion why not switch to a larger caliber like .45 ACP? People now-a-days are so wrapped up in high perfomance bullets they probably don't really believe a FMJ ever stopped anyone. It's amazing that Wild Bill Hickok did so well with his 36 caliber black powder round ball six shooters,lol.
 

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Over penetration is the issue many have with a FMJ as a carry round esp. in a 9mm. May not only eliminate the threat but also a non threat or two behind them.
 

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I use them , if they don't expand it is no worse than a fmj , from the test that I have seen on this site they do not do that bad
 

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Shooting into the ground can only be considered "ballistic testing" if you're planning on fighting off a monster made entirely of dirt and/or mud (AKA golem). :D

Do some poking around on YouTube and some random Google searches. The "bargain" stuff is only cheap because it's no longer the latest-and-greatest "premium" stuff. Give it another 10 years ... heck, maybe even just 5 years. Today's Gold Dots and HST's will be tomorrow's Silvertips and UMC JHP's. Hopefully in the future they'll start selling Gold Dots and HST's in big-box stores like Bass Pro without the stupid "Law Enforcement Only" packaging BS.
 

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Digging a bullet out the ground is hardly scientific evidence of performance. If you are so worried about bullet expansion why not switch to a larger caliber like .45 ACP? People now-a-days are so wrapped up in high perfomance bullets they probably don't really believe a FMJ ever stopped anyone. It's amazing that Wild Bill Hickok did so well with his 36 caliber black powder round ball six shooters,lol.
Well, if you had read and considered everything I wrote - you would have noticed I "dug up" the UMC round with a 40 S&W. I was asking for experience with Fiocchi, because I shoot it for practice with my Ruger SR40C. When I have it loaded for home defense, it has 165 gr XPD1 in it. I realize a round in the dirt is not a "ballistic" test. In fact I'd argue shots in water, gel, wet newspaper and the like aren't real "ballistic tests" either. Real world results mean more than anything, but I don't want to shoot my neighbor's pig, or poach deer to find out. However, I would think hittng dirt behind a paper target would cause a JHP to expand if it was inclined to do so in the first place. I also won't disagree with your assessment about ball ammo and placement, but the whole idea of expanding ammo is energy transfer and shock. A well placed ball still doesn't do anyone anygood if it was used in self-defense and the criminal is still able threaten myself, or others - even if he dies hours later. Yes, a well placed round in the right place probably ends any threat. But, I'm not that good with the PF-9 when I'm not under stress. Maybe with the SR40C, but not the PF-9 - yet. :D
 

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The Rem 115jhp used to be the load recommended for older 9mms that weren't designed to feed jhps (for example, old Browning HiPowers). It may not be the best jhp out there but at 1052fps (at least that's what it avgs out of mine), it's still pretty potent. Low recoil, fast followup shots, easy on gun and shooter, etc. The fired primers kinda pucker up some but I've never had a light strike with em. It doesn't always expand in "clothed wetpack" but neither do some more expensive brands I've tested and as was said, wet newspaper may not give the same results as the real thing?
 
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