[Toakey45036]

I'm breaking in my new Ruger LCP 2. I previously ran about 50 rounds thru it and fired another 26 rounds of ball ammo this afternoon. I decided to switch to re-manufactured JHP rounds that I've used in the past in all my guns. On firing the third round in the first magazine I felt a stinging sensation in my right hand. I noticed that the mag had started to slip out of the gun and the slide was all the way to the rear and jammed. I next noticed that the assembly pin was missing; I found it on the floor. I removed the mag and the remaining rounds were loose because the follower was half way down the mag, cocked and stuck. I finally manhandled the slide off the frame and the barrel was stuck in the slide. The Range gunsmith got the barrel out of the slide by tapping it with a mallet. The barrel was free of obstructions and there was a spent round in the chamber with a rupture in its' side near the base (click on pics to enlarge). The casing will easily slip into the chamber only if the rupture is lined up directly over the chamber feed ramp. Width of rupture is also approximately the same as the width of the feed ramp.

Since the barrel was found fully seated in the slide and the ruptured round in the chamber, I can only assume that with the gun in battery, when the firing pin struck the primer, the casing failed before the bullet left its' seat/crimp. Any other theories?

The pressure wave from the rupture could have jammed the slide back and forced the mag follower down and cocked it. As for the assembly pin exiting the gun??? The pressure wave? Or is the pin the chicken or the egg?

I reassembled the gun and all functions work OK manually. I don't want to shoot it until I've cleaned it and done a good inspection.

All thought and comments are welcome.

PS. No physical damage to the shooter.

 

[ral357]

The obvious suspect is a overcharged round. It's not a rare occurrence in blow back guns to have the case rupture if it's a hot load. I would have Ruger or a COMPETENT smith check her out before using it again and use only mild factory fresh or your own reloads.

 

[lklawson]

My bet it similar to an over-charged round but not. I'm guessing bullet setback caused over-pressure.

Did the smith clear the gun for return to use?

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[haertig]

First off, glad you weren't hurt! That is the main thing.

I don't understand when you say the round was in the chamber. Certainly not fully in the chamber, because there would be no way for that jagged case metal to be sticking out to the side like in your picture - the chamber would have constrained it.

My guess is that the missing assembly pin was the CAUSE of the failure, not the result of it. If that pin was missing when the cartridge fired, then there would have been nothing holding the gun together to assure it was fully in battery at ignition time, and nothing to hold it together to assure the slide didn't move rearward before enough pressure had been bled off to be safe.

But you really can't say it was the assembly pins fault with any certainty. True, if it was missing at ignition time, I would expect to see something like your experience. But if it was solidly in place at ignition time, then as you said, it could have been dislodged during the failure. Hard to say. I would check that assembly pin and see if it possibly comes out "too easily" when you're just playing with it. And also, I'd check if it is possible, through human error or poor design, to accidentally get that pin inserted and apparently functional, but not FULLY inserted. If it's possible to get it in there, but maybe 1/16" shy of fully inserted, there could be an issue there.

Again, glad you weren't hurt.

 

[haugrdr]

Dave, the chamber is only partially supported (enclosed). Plenty of room for this blowout.

I agree with your opinion...this missing pin probably caused the blowout. Just my experienced opinion of coarse.

 

[haertig]

Oh, wow. I've never handled a Ruger LCP and didn't know the chamber was not fully supported (I assume this would be the same on the Keltec P3AT as well??) In my ignorance, I'd call that "A disaster waiting to happen". But what do I know? I'm not a firearm designer. Maybe it's perfectly OK to have a cartridge half-unsupported by the chamber. Live and learn. Thanks for increasing my knowledge about this.

 

[haugrdr]

Yep, very same thing in a P3AT or P32 or PF9 or P11....lol...or any 1911...I can go on all day. Most pistols do not have fully supported or enclosed chambers. Some are much more so than others. Glocks seem to be almost completely supported, at least my Glock 19 is.

Sometimes it's hard to tell if a chamber is supported or not...as this picture shows.

 

[haertig]

Well, now you went and ruined it for me. You mentioned PF9, so I went and checked mine. Sure enough, there is a little crescent of the case that is unsupported, directly over the feed ramp. Bummer. I grabbed the closest 9mm sitting next to me (that's sad to have so many "sitting next to us", but probably many KTOGers are like this!) It happened to by my HK P30S, and that one DOES have a fully supported chamber. It's even support around the entire circumference of the chamber mouth.

Well, I guess I should have checked my own gun before spouting my mouth off about "A disaster waiting to happen". Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. Given my choice, I would prefer full chamber support. I just didn't realize some of my guns, at least the PF9, doesn't have that. Oops. I feel stupid now.

 

[Gènetics]

For various reasons I don't/won't use remanufactured ammo in my pocket pistols (but hey)personal preference based on issues just like yours!
I picked up an LCP2 at the beginning of the year & I love it, it's VERY accurate & issue free (over 1,000 rounds blazer brass) "Until" I bought 300 rounds of 95g Lawman, it'll stove pipe almost once every 6 round mag! I'm selling the leftover 250 rounds & sticking with blazer brass.
I know my post isn't much help but my experience with the smaller firearms is they just seem a little more finicky....
Hey- Good thing you didn't take a hit & stay safe my friend.

 

[BlakeHanson]

Thank goodness you're ok. As said, that's the important part.
I must say I am alarmed!
I had no idea that they did that with the little guns.
Learned something new

. Thank you KTOG

.
That looks like over 1/8" of unsupported case.
The LCP is now off the table for a proposed CCW for SO.
The G27 looks to be ok to me:

I think it was an over-pressure case.

"decided to switch to re-manufactured JHP rounds"

 

[Steve912]

Heh...the Glock 27 was the pistol that put the term
'ka-boom' into the shooting world's vocabulary.

OP, how about more info on the ammo?

 

[circlehawk]

Good to hear that you're ok...I'm gonna agree with everyone here that this is THE most important thing.

 

[lklawson]

I had no idea that they did that with the little guns.

Designers do that with tons of guns in lots of "straight walled" pistol calibers. Glocks, 1911's, Remingtons, Colts, Rugers. It's very common.

What doesn't surprise me is that he's uninjured. Bear with me on this. I'm glad that he's uninjured, I really am, and I don't deny that a mini-grenade went off in his fist.

Case ruptures happen. Not a lot, but it's one of the more common "catastrophic" failures of ammunition today. Had one happen to me not too long ago. But most of the time when a case rupture happens, there are relatively minor injuries, if any at all. Usually it's associated with "shrapnel" of case brass and burning gasses/powder being ejected into the face or hand. Modern handgun designers have deliberately designed to direct case ruptures down the magazine well, which has lots of volume (and a spring) to soak up a lot of energy and, when the magazine fails, more-or-less "safely" vents the remaining energy out the bottom of the pistol butt which is away from the hand and away from the body (and particularly from the face).

Look around on the 'net for instances of case rupture. Usually the worst you'll see if some minor cutting and bruising to the hand. Yes, there are some instances of fingers getting blown off. But that's fairly rare.

So, while I'm very glad that he wasn't injured, I'm also both pleased and impressed with the engineering and design process which helped lead to this outcome.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[lklawson]

The G27 looks to be ok to me:

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk

 

[Toakey45036]

Heh...the Glock 27 was the pistol that put the term
'ka-boom' into the shooting world's vocabulary.

OP, how about more info on the ammo?

Now-a-days I wouldn't give out info like that without talking to a Lawyer. Suffice to say that the re-manufacturer sells at most gun shows in SW Ohio for sure. Probably most of Ohio, Michigan and other states. I've bought and shot a couple thousand rounds from them without any problems.

 

[Gènetics]

Now-a-days I wouldn't give out info like that without talking to a Lawyer. Suffice to say that the re-manufacturer sells at most gun shows in SW Ohio for sure. Probably most of Ohio, Michigan and other states. I've bought and shot a couple thousand rounds from them without any problems.

Couple thousand rounds in one firearm might make another firearm throw temper tantrums IE the LCP2 Is very particular & there are plenty of videos on you tube to prove it (including my own experience).

In regards to talking to an attorney before telling folks what brand ammo your using - Well- ummm , thanks for the chuckle

 

[Toakey45036]

Couple thousand rounds in one firearm might make another firearm throw temper tantrums IE the LCP2 Is very particular & there are plenty of videos on you tube to prove it (including my own experience).

In regards to talking to an attorney before telling folks what brand ammo your using - Well- ummm , thanks for the chuckle

A couple thousand round with a dozen guns is not very many per gun.

Your welcome. In todays society, where people sue at the drop of a hat, I'm not going to take a chance on naming a manufacturer who's product was involved in a potentially dangerous incident. Overly cautious? Probably.

 

[tx-rvr]

Of course you could be sued for not telling someone what brand ammo gave trouble when they got hurt. You can be sued just for being alive if you find the correct lawyer.

Steve

P.S. I don't reload for other people anymore.

 

[Steve912]

Now-a-days I wouldn't give out info like that without talking to a Lawyer. Suffice to say that the re-manufacturer sells at most gun shows in SW Ohio for sure. Probably most of Ohio, Michigan and other states. I've bought and shot a couple thousand rounds from them without any problems.

Well, alrighty. Unsub.

 

[guru2sum]

It seems the original Glock .40s had a problem with unsupported chambers:

http://www.thesixgunjournal.net/an-...-or-lack-thereof-in-glock-40-caliber-pistols/

You can find more references by Googling.