occasional failure to fire problem

Discussion in 'P-3AT' started by Tree, Feb 27, 2008.

  1. Tree

    Tree New Member

    7
    Feb 27, 2008
    Hi, another new guy here ;D.  Anyways I bought my P3AT new 2 years ago.  I have 450 rounds through it.  It seem that the typical failure to feed and eject problems are gone but a new problem has started and I cannot figure it out.  Usually on the 3rd or 4th mag then gun will fail to fire on the 2nd or 3rd round.  The hammer drops but the gun wont fire.  The weird thing, other than it not firing, is that you can keep pulling the trigger and the hammer will keep dropping as if the trigger is automatically resetting without the slide  coming back.  Now if I manually rack the slide back after the failure the gun will fire a few more rounds again.  Any ideas?  By the way, great site, lots of good info!

    Tree
     
  2. JFB

    JFB New Member

    Jul 25, 2005
    Welcome to KTOG.

    Got to admitt, your first post is a good one.  Hopefully some one will be able to explain

     

  3. zeke

    zeke New Member

    Dec 20, 2005
    Is there any mark at all on the primer, when this happens?

    I'm thinking there's not. Here's my guess - for some reason the hammer block isn't letting the hammer fall all the way to strike the firing pin. This would explain why you can keep pulling the trigger and the hammer moves without manually resetting.

    If the hammer were going far enough to strike the firing pin it would be past the hammer block and would need to be reset either manually or by the slide cycling.

    If the hammer is only falling to the hammer block then, then it wouldn't need reset and you could pull the trigger again, causing it to fall to the hammer block again. etc.

    I have no idea why manually cycling the slide would let it work normally for a few rounds.


    My course of action to fix it would be to call KT for a new grip with the hammer block already installed. Explain to them that your hammer block isn't working correctly. You would probably have to buy the new grip, then return your's for credit, or you may be able to send yours in and they return you a new one.

    Other options
    Ask for a hammer block and install it yourself, I don't recommend this, I haven't changed one, but am willing to believe the others here that it's an experience worth missing.

    If your not comfortable changing the grip out yourself, it's really just removing the frame from the girp then installing the frame in a new grip, then you should send it in for service. If you do this make sure you send a letter detailing what it is doing and how long it takes before it happens (3 to 4 mags) .

    Check here for a video on replacing the grip
    http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1201577117


    There are also written directions with pics if you need them here
    http://www.1bad69.com/keltec/disassembly.htm
     
  4. Tree

    Tree New Member

    7
    Feb 27, 2008
    Zeke, thanks for the input.  That makes since.  There is no mark on the primer when this happens.  I will call Keltec and see what they have to say.

    Tree
     
  5. cm

    cm New Member

    459
    Jun 3, 2007
    Trenton, MI.
    Hi Tree.
    I had that happen.  
    The slide was not all the way home.
    The breech was not locked in place.
    The slide was about 1/16" from home.
    I blamed it on a bad round.
    May be the chamber was dirty.
    Only happened a couple time.
    Charlie.
     
  6. Tree

    Tree New Member

    7
    Feb 27, 2008
    Thanks for the input Charlie! This has now happened several times now with this gun. I always clean the gun very well after I shoot it but the failure continues. At first I did think that it was an issue with the slide not returning home, but it always appears to. I sent Kel-tec an email to see what I can do to take care of this but have not heard back from them yet. I might just call them today if I get a chance. I have had this gun for 2 years and never been able to carry it due to working the bugs out of it so I would really like to get this P3AT working good for summer carry :)
     
  7. RAT76

    RAT76 Active Member

    Aug 21, 2006
    Oklahoma
    I'd call, they don't do email well.
     
  8. Tree

    Tree New Member

    7
    Feb 27, 2008
    I have noticed that, will call thanks!
     
  9. wyo-man

    wyo-man New Member

    726
    Nov 27, 2006
    Welcome Tree,
    Please keep us informed.

    wyo-man
     
  10. Tree--- Please do report back... I think this is the first time I have heard of this particualr issue.

    And like the others said....CALL them and ask for the service department.

    Kel--Tec DOES NOT DO E-MAIL.

    CALL...
     
  11. Tree

    Tree New Member

    7
    Feb 27, 2008
    Well I tried to call but could not get through today, always busy. I will let you guys know what the fix is when we get it figured out. I will try and get a hold of them next week now!
     
  12. Zell

    Zell New Member

    25
    Feb 20, 2008
    Good luck!
     
  13. gvaldeg1

    gvaldeg1 New Member

    152
    Feb 8, 2008
    Why not just send the whole gun back to Kel-Tec? Hasn't the lifetime warranty always applied?
     
  14. TxCajun

    TxCajun Administrator Staff Member Supporter

    Sep 7, 2004
    Texas
    Sure the warranty applies but if the hammer block is the issue, the grip (with hammer block installed) can be changed in about 5 minutes vs several weeks for returning the gun to the factory. It sure can't hurt to try that first. One of the excellent things about KT's service is that they will often send you new parts for free if you explain your issue to service. Most manufactures won't do that and would require that you send it in even for something relatively easily fixed with a new, easily changed part.
     
  15. Tree

    Tree New Member

    7
    Feb 27, 2008
    I finally called Kel-Tec a few days ago. After explaining what was going on the tech just said send it back. So I started looking into shipping. It seems to me like it was going to be a pain in the butt and expensive to ship, as well as taking a long time to get it back. So I decided to take the gun out and put a few rounds through it again to find out a little more about when and how it was failing to fire. The first 3 mags worked great. The 4th, 5th, and 6th mag each had at least one failure to fire. The slide always returned to the home position before the failure, it is the hammer only returning to the half cocked position when the trigger is pulled therefore not striking the firing pin when this happens. Each time it happened I was able to just pull the trigger a couple more times and it would finally fire the round. The problem seemed to occur more often when firing quicker shots but I always made sure to fully release the trigger and I was able to duplicate the problem while slow firing. Today I was able to clean the gun and decided to go ahead and take the frame out of the grip to check things out. Man this gun is easy to work on! Anyways I cleaned it up real good and everything to me appeared to look normal. The hammer block and spring seemed to be in great condition. The only thing I noticed was the right hand rear corner of the slide was slightly bent out. This is in the area where the slide actually touches the trigger bar. I was able to straighten it back out and put everything back together. Now I plan on taking the gun out one more time since I have been through it with the frame out, cleaned it all up, and made a slight adjustment to the slide. If problems still continue I plan on just asking for parts from Kel-Tec. I will be flying the next 5 days so I will report back some time next week. Thanks for all the suggestions :)