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New & confused KSG owner

11K views 54 replies 10 participants last post by  BlakeHanson 
#1 ·
Recently purchased a stunning KSG for $966 after tax. Tore it completely down, cleaned the barrel and all internals. I have used Red N Tacky grease instead of standard oil for a couple years. It tends to stay where I put it and has amazing heat resistance.

I added an AFG2 and a Sitemark red dot and was feeling super tacti-cool. Now, I am a Combat Veteran discharged in 2011 and have been around guns most of my life. I have been wanting a KSG since they came out so I am well aware of the ejection issues regarding the bulk, Walmart birdshot. I had seen a few people have luck with them.

I started with some high brass Winchester buckshot. Second round was a FTE. Now I had the KSG for a week and was beyond excited before shooting it so this could’ve likely been a user error. I then loaded up (15) 2-3/4 slugs. Good god! No issues at all except it may have broken my collar bone! Then I started trying to feed some super cheap, Winchester, Walmart special birdshot and yup- every other round was FTE. Was demoralizing and frustrating. I forced roughly 60 through it and gave up. I was hoping I had one of the ‘golden’ models that would eat anything.

Today I went and bought some Federal High-Brass #4 in 2-3/4 and some less expensive Rio Game Load 7.5 birdshot in 2-3/4. I have read here that the cheap Winchester has an aluminum hull that fireforms to the chamber which can make it hard to eject? The Rio Game Loads are a bronze color so is it safe to assume they are steel or brass and should be ok? Will the high brass #4 be ok?

I am hopeful you all can help save me a bit of money by advising what will be best to stay away from?

I have also read you can ‘polish the internals’ to help, but I’m honestly terrified to attempt this. I have a Yugo AK that I sanded down the trigger and rails to smooth out the action, but any guidance?

Lastly, can anyone help me confirm if I have a newer KSG or ‘new old stock’? My S/N is: XX9534. I attempted to use the matrix on the existing forums, but am baffled.

Any and all advice/tips are very much welcomed. Thanks in advance!!
 

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Discussion starter · #3 ·
I've been fortunate to not have feeding or ejection issues. I'm not sure of your technique but I rack the everloving crap out of my KSG, the empties are coming out at warp speed.

There's also a fluff and buff section in the KSG FAQ on the main ksg forum that may help. Or you could sit on the couch and rack the slide a few hundred times to break it in some, UNLOADED of course.
What have you shot.
 
Discussion starter · #5 ·
Most of everything, if you're referring to shells. I've not had any issues with the Winchester bulk packs in question, though my round count on those is under 200. No problems with bulk, buck, slugs, even minis work just fine.

I have had problems previously with the Winchester shells in other shotguns and it's always been a problem with the rim 'tearing' at the extractor.
It wasn’t an issue with racking hard enough. The extractor wouldn’t get a solid catch and would break free when I would pull the slide back to eject the round. I took my time and wasn’t trying rapid fire. Just seemed to have an issue getting a good bite
 
Discussion starter · #7 ·
I must have misunderstood the original post, now I see what you're saying. It doesn't seem that a fluff and buff would help if the extractor isn't getting a good bite. I'd call or email KT and see what they say, they'll likely send replacement parts for no charge. It could be as simple as replacing the extractor
Hmm. Ok
 
Discussion starter · #9 ·
The usual fix for failures to extract is to polish the chamber.
Some newer shotguns have chambers rougher then older guns, and often give failures to extract with cheaper ammo.

Kel-Tec parkerizes the KSG chamber and bore and that makes the chamber rough enough to cause many people problems.

The roughness of the parkerizing causes some shells, especially cheap, bulk shells to stick enough to give failures to extract.
There are several methods of doing a chamber polish and any gunsmith can do it for you for a minimal charge.
You can also easily do it yourself.

One easy method is to get a drill, a section of a shotgun cleaning rod, or a hardwood dowel at the hardware store.
For the cleaning rod, screw on a used 12 gauge bore brush and wrap it with 0000 steel wool.
For the wood dowel, use a saw to saw a slit in the front and insert the end of some fine wet or dry sand cloth then wrap it around the dowel.

With either, put the rod or dowel into an electric drill and insert the brush and 0000 steel wool or sand cloth into the chamber.
Running the drill at medium speed, continually move the rod up and down the chamber to polish.
Keep the rod moving at all times.
This should take only a few minutes, so inspect often and don't over do it.
When the chamber has a uniform, smooth and shiny surface with no traces of the parkerizing left, quit.

After polishing, thoroughly clean the chamber and bore with solvent and keep a thin layer of lube in it unless shooting.
This will usually cure the failures to extract.
You can also use the same technique to polish the bore too.
This smooths the bore and makes it easier to clean.

Using the steel wool on a bore brush has long been a valid gunsmithing technique to smooth a rough chamber, and it's been used for many years as a method of cleaning a fouled barrel of lead and plastic.

As for the "Fluff and Buff, it's in the sticky FAQ section at the top of the KSG section.
Doing a smoothing operation has great benefits for the KSG and pretty much eliminates short stroking problems.

My KSG now operates so smoothly I can very gently operate it and it works 100% without the usual recommendation to just hammer the gun while operating it.

Doing a smoothing job (not a "like a mirror" polish) is fairly easy and can be done with minimal tools and if done correctly, with no risk to the gun.

I have an article in the articles section on the general aspects of doing a polish job to firearms.
This is not specific to the KSG, but I eventually intend to do an enhanced fluff and buff for the KSG from a gunsmiths perspective.
Right now, just follow the fluff and buff posts in the FAQ's, polish the chamber, and you may be surprised at how nicely your KSG operates.

Last, you have a newer KSG.
The "XX" serial number guns are the most recent.
This makes a lot of sense. While cleaning I noticed what looked like carbon build up in the chamber and roughly the first 3” of the barrel. I was trying to clean with a bore snake so I soaked it with cleaner and went at it with a regular rod, but still couldn’t remove it
 
Discussion starter · #11 ·
KT puts this in their manual to sidestep the problem:
View attachment 34013
You can rest assured that any cheap ammo you buy at Wally-world isn't up to their :quote:standard:quote:.

Here's the rest of the story:
In the beginning, they smoothed the chambers after the barrels came back from being parkerized. This is a time-consuming (read: expen$ive) step. When they ramped up production, they found out they would shoot high-brass just fine without it so they dropped this step out.

In a nutshell, if you want to shoot cheap ammo, you'll have to smooth your chamber like Dfariswheel said, or $hoot a bunch of ammo thru it to do the same, or send it back and they will smooth it for free.
Thank you! SEE PICTURES BELOW Decided to read the manual and bam. Sounds like I may be able to get away with low brass if it’s actually brass. I have some Rio 7.5 that appears to be Steel or aluminum and will advise the outcome.

As we speak, I took dfariswheels proactive advice and am totally disassembling it to polish everything. I hit a dead end at the mag plugs.

Finally removed them (1/2 turn at a time) but only one side came off. The side that did come off popped the snap ring. The other side is free spinning but is acting like it’s stuck. Should I just give it a pull with pliers? I tried to screw the other side in to add tension but to no avail.

Really trying to like my $1,000 shotgun but am getting very demoralized.
 

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Discussion starter · #13 ·
The mag tube bolts are captured, they are not supposed to be completely removed from the barrel assembly. The barrel assembly of your KSG is probably force/friction fit into the receiver, thereby making separation from the receiver very difficult w/o extra force . One of my KSG's had a burr on the receiver that needed to be smoothed before the barrel assembly would separate from the receiver w/o having to use a wooden block & mallet to persuade it.
Good lord. The one side came off with no force. I will screw it in loosely and drive on.

Greatly appreciate y’alls help
 
Discussion starter · #16 ·
Did you read that you have to press down on the cartridge stop actuator to get it apart?
View attachment 34016
Well that is the one thing I was actually aware of. I believe I have this mess I created sorted out. I luckily found the snap ring with no damage. Due to my frustration, I’m leaving it as is to do some further research to avoid any damage. Also need to grab some snap ring pliers and some steel wool.

If I polish the chamber and the first inch or so of the barrel, will that void my warranty with Kel-Tek?
 
Discussion starter · #17 ·
Well that is the one thing I was actually aware of. I believe I have this mess I created sorted out. I luckily found the snap ring with no damage. Due to my frustration, I’m leaving it as is to do some further research to avoid any damage. Also need to grab some snap ring pliers and some steel wool.

If I polish the chamber and the first inch or so of the barrel, will that void my warranty with Kel-Tek?
But is as fully disassembled as you can take it down.
 
Discussion starter · #19 ·
Unless you use like some 80-grit sandpaper and ruin the barrel where they have to replace it, no.
There's been some pretty bad horror stories on here about what some have done to theirs (including outright damage:eek:) and I've never heard one come back that the warranty was void.
If you send it back as a box of parts and one of the parts is missing, they may make you pay for that part (if it's expensive):rolleyes:.
Thank you, sir. I will be getting 0000 Steel wool as suggested and use a cleaning rod.

Good to know kel-Tec won’t take issue. Thank you all again. It has been obnoxiously difficult to find detailed direction on the KSG.
 
Discussion starter · #20 ·
Unless you use like some 80-grit sandpaper and ruin the barrel where they have to replace it, no.
There's been some pretty bad horror stories on here about what some have done to theirs (including outright damage:eek:) and I've never heard one come back that the warranty was void.
If you send it back as a box of parts and one of the parts is missing, they may make you pay for that part (if it's expensive):rolleyes:.
Kind of a dumb question but everything say just polish the chamber and bore. Can anyone provide me with a link or better description? Should I just polish the entire chamber that holds the bolt and bolt carrier? For the bore, should I polish any of the actual barrel or just the enclosure before the barrel?
 
Discussion starter · #23 ·
Remove the barrel assembly from the receiver and magazine tubes assembly.

Just to help prevent any chance of damage, use a metric Allen wrench to disassemble the plastic hand guard from the barrel.
That will include removing the top rail.
Once you have just the barrel assembly, polish just the inside of the chamber where the shells seat and the entire bore.
What I did was use my regular barrel cleaning brush to knock off all that black junk in the chamber and about the first 1.5” of the barrel. It seems to have made it a different color so I’m assuming it knocked off all the parkerizing. Put a thin coat of bearing grease over all metal to metal parts.

Got the snap ring back on the mag tube bolt as well. If I still have any FTE’s with low brass I will throw some steel wool on my cleaning rod and smooth it out
 
Discussion starter · #27 ·
Remove the barrel assembly from the receiver and magazine tubes assembly.
The owner's manual clearly shows how to do this.
Unfortunately, it does not. That’s the entire reason I posted here. Zero definitive literature on step by step. Manual doesn’t indicate anything other than unscrew mag tube lugs.

I came here for assistance and guidance from individuals who had to go through what I am.

My initial post was looking for guidance on ammunition (what works and what doesn’t).

I used my standard barrel cleaning brush to knock of the excess parkerizing & I believe it will suffice.

Again, their is limited definitive information in the manual or online. Several opinion based rants, but no common denominator that indicates a solution. That’s the only reason I’m here
 

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Discussion starter · #38 ·
Ok, now I’m really confused! So I believe I managed to clean the parkerizing of by spend an hour manually brushing the chamber and bore with just the regular bore brush. Went to the range last night with super cheap Rio 7.5 birdshot. Every one cycled with not a single hiccup!

I then loaded it up with some high brass slugs and had multiple double feeds due to FTE’s. These are the same slugs that previously cycled with no issue.

I very liberally applied bearing grease to the entire bolt carrier group as I do with all my weapons. I checked the extractor once I got home and it did appear to have a tiny amount of grease on it, but why would it cycle the cheap, low aluminum birdshot and not high brass?
 
Discussion starter · #41 ·
A light coating of oil is all that's needed. Bearing grease belongs on what it's made for, bearings. Too much grease is just gonna cause problems by collecting un-burnt power and other crud. Strip that grease from your bolt/carrier and receiver with solvent or brake cleaner and LIGHTLY lube it with a good gun oil or even a graphite based lube. Your guns will thank you.
Everyone has a preference. Too much gun oil will collect carbon as well. Plenty of pros and cons for using grease and/or oil. Lubricant manufactures even make grease. The active ingredients are exactly the same in my bearing grease as they are in the ‘gun’ grease. Gun lubricants just mark it up 500%. My issue is the FTE on high brass
 
Discussion starter · #44 ·
Gun Firearm Trigger Airsoft Air gun
Gun Trigger
Knife Leather
Firearm Gun Trigger Airsoft gun Airsoft
Minus the KSG, I use bearing grease on everyone of these and have since they were new. All have between 6,000-10,000 rounds through them. The internals look immaculate. The bearing grease significantly reduces wear for me and cleaning is just a simple wipe down
 
Discussion starter · #47 ·
And you would be correct. Besides extreme temperature, it has high persistence to wash-out and prevents galling with sliding surfaces under extreme pressure.
Something you may want to look into is 3% Moly-disulfide grease instead of wheel-bearing grease. It has even more ability to resist sliding metal wear than wheel-bearing or regular NLGI-2 (chassis grease).
If you dig deep enough, you'll find it has Mil-specs and costs close to the same as others.
"Gun-grease" has been around since WWII and oil is not enough for sliding metal-to-metal surfaces to prevent wear, especially with 'wash-out'.

Back to your problem: The slightest bit of that stuff on the extractor will allow it to lose it's grip on the case rim and allow it to pop off of the high-brass and give you a FTE.
Maybe taking a Q-tip with some solvent to the claw of the extractor will make a big difference.
Blakehanson- I owe you a beer, sir. I suspected that was the issue, but it got dark and needed to leave. It has been driving me mad not knowing for sure.

I will also check out this grease you speak of!
 
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