[riverkeeper]

JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

'The FMJ v JHP v Alternate Rounds' discussion is fairly interesting and at times provokes some new thinking.

Getting adequate penetration with substantial wound channel damage....etc etc.

Baseline Info::: Gold Dots and DPX rounds  seem to get 9-10 on penetration with reliable and decent expansion thru fabric and AE FMJ about 16 inches thru fabric wo expansion.

Terminal pereformance in recent years for many rounds in other calibers was to get expansion and modest penetration thru naked gelatin AND substantially more penetration with little expansion when the gelatin had thick clothes.

I want good performance in my 380...it seems to me that balancing penetration and expansion to specifically and reliability perform this way would not necessarily be a bad thing. A round that adjusts to the BGs clothing or lack thereof....winter and summer.

Question--- Is there a round which will get 9-10 WHEN it expands  BUT  when it doesn't expand gets 15-16 inches consistantly?  

Think I'll get a  cup of coffe and wait for someone to call me stoopid.  

I carry gold dots and consider my practice round, ae fmj, to be ok too.   dpx sound$ good too my $hop doe$n't carry them.

 

[Hutch01]

Re: JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

There is no magic bullet.....yet again!


Edited to add

Well, yes there is. It's the one with which you practice!

 

[Packer]

Re: JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

+1

 

[bdbirddog]

Re: JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

I think there was a magic bullet once, but somebody used it on that Kennedy fella ;D

 

[Packer]

Re: JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

Good one! ;D

Packer.

 

[adamsesq]

Re: JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

I think there was a magic bullet once, but somebody used it on that Kennedy fella ;D

Uh Oh, now you went and did it. Mention Kennedy and bullet in the same post and the special secret higher than high government that even the cia and president don't know about is going to mind meld everyone of us and this group will "go black."

-Scott

 

[Packer]

Re: JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

Wiley? Is that you? What have you done with Scott?

Packer.

 

[Guest]

Re: JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

riverkeeper 16" of penetration is at least 4 inches outside of my body. I will take the expansion of the dpx round.

 

[rcmodel]

Re: JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

+1 Jocko

I'll take the expansion of just about any decent JHP over RN-FMJ penetration.

Even .30 carbine FMJ at twice the velocity of a .380 does nothing more then poke a small hole (ice-pick wound) through living tissue. The hole closes up behind the bullet, and there is often very little internal, and next to no external bleeding.
I have seen coyotes run over half a mile before finally dying with a GI RN-FMJ through the lungs.

Whether it expands or not, the open JHP tip also cuts at least a small hole, rather then the skin stretching out around it like RN-FMJ, then closing back up to seal off the wound.

Bottom line for me is, the more internal damage to organs, the more & quicker the blood loss both inside & outside, the more likely the wound is to have some immediate effect from the body going into shock.

rcmodel

 

[Guest]

Re: JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

The following was taken from an article I found on the subject This was the link for it.

_______________________________________
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semi-automatic_self-loading_pistol

Bullets for use on humans are usually designed to comply with the FBI's penetration requirement of 12 to 18 inches (30 to 46 cm), which is based on the IWBA's requirement of 12.5 to 14 inches (32 to 36 cm). This is to ensure that the bullet can reach a vital blood-bearing organ or central nervous system structure from most angles. Frangible rounds, while they are sold for defensive purposes, are not well suited for the role, as they generally penetrate less than 10 inches (25 cm), and are therefore prone to failure when they must pass through nonvital tissues, such as a hand or arm. When they work, they work very well, but when they fail, they tend to fail badly.

Hollowpoint bullets normally expand most when at their highest velocity; that is, when entering the target. As they expand, they slow. Hollowpoint bullets may not expand when they strike sheet metal, glass, or bulky clothing before the target. These preliminary obstacles can either fill the hollowpoint cavity or deform the lips of the cavity. Either of these effects can prevent the high internal hydraulic pressure necessary to make the hollowpoint round expand.

For in-depth information on the mechanisms (and misconceptions) by which bullets incapacitate living targets, see the article on stopping power.

________________________________________

It's my opinion, that with the larger cal.'s ( 9mm, 40, or greater) I'll go with JHP as it can penetrate deeper with expansion. However, with my 32 I want the deeper penetration! I feel this is the only chance with this round to reach a vital organ. Especially in winter with heavier clothing worn.

 

[Guest]

Re: JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

some hp just didn't perform right every time out of the 380 and maybe that is where we are getting so many different opinions, but there is no doubt the 380 dpx rounds expands every time, retains 100% of its bullet weight and the expansion from every photo that I have seen is totally awsome. It is going to do big time damage for whatever depth it reaches.

jocko, who has now filed all his sights and rounded off the front of his kt380, in case he fires all 7 rounds and BG is still there and takes my gun and wants to put it somewhere on my body ;D

 

[Guest]

Re: JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

firedog, I was talking about the kt 380 not the 32. Have not read any great reports on any 32 HP performing a sit should Just not enough ump there IMO, but once again if you shoot hps in ur 32 and the don't expand, you have a fmj, if they do expancd any at all, you now have the workings of a hp. I shoot the corbon hp with rimlock kt in my 32 for 24/7 carry, but my main topic was the dpx 380 round and I don't see the fmj taking its place in my 380 anyhow. Since the 380 has come out the 32 sales have slowed big time, price is very close to the same, weapon same size, more power bigger hole, much better bullet variation to choose from--a no-brainer IMO. course I own two 380 kt and one 32 kt, so I can row in anyones boat.

 

[fatman]

Re: JHP  v  FMJ Question ... yet again!

+1 rcmodel!

firedog978: My family has 3 P32s and we load all of them with Corbon JHPs. This is the only JHP in this caliber I consider to have both enough penetration and expansion under most conditions. Many people worry about having enough penetration to get through winter clothing. This round is to some extent self adjusting as the standard HP cavity, as it fills with clothing, often functions as a FML.

I consider this a good load. There are no perfect loads in my opinion so my philosophy is to select a good load then concentrate on practice and tactics.