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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Alright guys, as sad as it is, seems my P3AT is definitely defective. I've been patient with it trying everything I could to get it to work right, but it's just not functioning the way it should.

Here's a history of it:

I took it to the range tha day I bought it and put 100 rounds of Remington UMC 95 grain .380 FMJ through it. The first 100 rounds were ok, but had a bunch of jams, however nothing beyond what I thought should be expected with it during the break in period.

I took it home and cleaned it very carefully. Nothing was used that could have damaged it.

A week later I decide the it's time to finish off the break-in period and go to the same range with a box of 50 Remington UMC's. This time as I'm shooting the first box, the performance degenerates quickly and within the first mag or two I was getting a FTF, FTE, or jam almost every single shot, if not every other shot. At least 1-2 problems with every magazine full.

I just thought at the time it was still in the break in period and that the problems with it would go away after break-in, like the problems went away with my Kahr PM9 after 400 rounds or so.

I went through the box and decided to try another box of UMC's to see if it would just go away. Instead it just got worse. I probably should have packed up and left then, but the people at the range were telling me how they all hear that Ketlec is crap and that they warned me - I shouldn't have bought a Keltec.

So I bought one last box of UMC's. Same thing. Just horrible... absolutely horrible. I kept trying to figure out what the problem was, but I couldn't see it.

At the end, I wasn't going to send it back to Keltec unless I had tested another ammo with it. So I bought a box of Speer Gold Dot .380 auto ($17.99 a box at the range).

To my surprise, all 20 rounds worked without a problem. I thought perhaps then my P3AT was just fussy about it's ammo and didn't like Remington UMC's, so I bought another box of Speer Gold Dot's to have, but my time was up at the range (1 hour) and it was time to go.

I talked to some people online and they told me to polish the feed ramp and make sure everything was well-cleaned and lubricated.

So I did this. Again being careful not to use anything abrasive. I collected ammo during the two weeks getting all different types of .380 ammo and ultimately had the following:

1 box of Speer Gold Dot .380 Auto (20 rounds)
1 box of Remington UMC .380 Auto FMJ (50 rounds)
1 box of Winchester Win-Clean .380 Auto BEB's (50 rounds)
1 box of Remington Golden Sabers .380 Auto (25 rounds)

I took this all to the range today along with some other guns.

the P3AT was 100% clean and perfectly lubricated.

I started with the Remington UMC's to see if anything had changed since my last experience. As before the performance was terrible. Almost every shot had a major problem. I went through 2 mags before I quit (12 shots).

Then I moved back to the Speer Gold Dots and they worked mostly, but there was 2 FTF's and 2 FTE's along with 1 jam.

I switched guns for a little while to let the P3AT cool off.

Later I came back and tried the Winchester Win-Clean BEB's. Every shot for 2 magazines worth had a major problem. So I gave up on that.

Then I switched to Remington Golden Sabers, these were a little better in performance than the UMC's, but still I had major problems almost every 2 or 3 shots.

I knew I wasn't limp-wristing and paid very close attention to this. I spent a large number of shots just focusing on my wrists and not even aiming just to make sure I wasn't doing something wrong.

Eventually my time was up and I returned home with half a box each of Remington UMC's and Winchester Win-Cleans.

Since buying the P3AT I've shot it at least 345 times. Instead of it getting better like would be expected during break in, it got worse and worse.

Under no circumstances could I consider carrying this gun as is.

During break-in, my PM9 had a few failures to return to battery and would get slightly stuck a half inch from returning to full battery. A simple tap on the back fixed it. Since break-in, it is flawless though and even my mother who is incredibly anti-gun has remarked how well I shoot with it. I was stunned when she told my father, "While I'm not thrilled about him having any guns, I have to say he's a pretty good shot and I watched him get lots of bullseyes on top of bullseyes." My father's response, "Well, I guess that's good that if he ever had to use his gun, the bad-guy won't be around to testify against him in court." ;)
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Anyways, after carefully analyzing my P3AT I think I have a few defective parts. I think the feed ramp is not right, the extractor isn't working properly even though it's the newer sharp style, and the little metal ejector piece that falls into place on the frame is not working right. It actually is very loose and wobbles quite a bit when in place.

Many times when I'd shoot the P3AT, the slide would go back, then return to battery, but the shell hadn't been extracted. To get it to extract, I couldn't just pull back the slide, but I had to pull it back hard, let go so it slams shut hard, and then pull the slide back again to eject the case. Most times I would have to eject the magazine to do this because the magazine would either get in the way, or the round from the magazine trying to make its way upward would only make things worse. While I'd agree that this sounds like limp wristing, I know that I wasn't limp wristing. I think the ejector and extractor are at fault.

So anyways, I'm sick of hearing the guys at the range say, "We told you so. Keltecs suck."

I really want to send it to Keltec and ask them to perfect it so I can go back to the range with a perfectly working P3AT. I think I just got unlucky with mine and was too optimistic about the break-in effect when I should have just sent it in 150 rounds ago.

Should I send it to them, and if so, how? UPS? Should I write a letter to go along with it?

How is Keltec's customer service?

btw- I live in Miami so I'd be shipping within the state of Florida.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
please excuse the typos. I see them now, but the post was so long my fingers are feeling lazy.
 

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If you have a 2mm hex head wrench, check to see if the extractor screw has loosened. It must be snug. If it has backed out a little, this will cause problems like you are experiencing. The fix is simple. Put a dab of purple or blue locktite on the top threads and snug the screw back in. Let us know.
 

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Before sending it back, make the following checks
1) besure there are no battered areas on the frame rails, usally opposite ejector, and at the ends (muzzle end)
2) you stated you are using "lube".  Most folks here say grease is needed.  I'll just say it needs to be slick.
3) disassemble and clean the magazine, the inside walls need to be clean and lubricated, the plug needs to be clean and slide extremmly smoothly.  when reassembling, be sure spring is such that it provides even lift, Not lifting hard in the rear
4) be sure the extractor 2mm screww is snug.  Check the extractor by sliding a round under it and with round near center, you should be able to turn slide various ways and the extractor hold round.

Any thing missed guys?

If after that, it still dosent extract and feed, it needs a trip home or sale it  and try another. Yours will not be the first.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I will check the screw. I don't think I have any loctite laying around, but if it's loose I can try a stop at the local hardware store if it's open tomorrow.

Also, just thought I'd mention that for cleaning I'm using Break Free CLP. I dry it off thoroughly afterwards and use Hoppes oil for protection and lube. I can't remember if I used some grease on the P3AT's rails two weeks ago when I cleaned it. If I did it would have been Tetra gun grease. I've used it on my PM9 but Hoppes #9 oil (plain jane orange bottle - not the Hoppes Elite stuff) seems to lubricate very well too and last night in anticipation of today's test - I added an extra drop on each rail and let it run vertically down to lubricate all the way.
 

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Check the extractor screw. I bet it's loose. :-/
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I seem to have every size except 2mm sitting in my toolbox.

It looks pretty "on there", but I need to find the right size for that screw before I know for sure.

Either somebody has raided my tools... or I've misplaced it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
finally found my universal hex wrench.

yes, the screw was loose and tightening it doesn't seem to do anything (must be stripped).

So should I send it back to Keltec, or try some loctite? Would loctite void the warranty?
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
well, I can't get that screw out at all. Turning it in either direction does nothing. Without slipping a blade or a thin flat-head screwdriver under it, I can't get it out to try putting some loctite on it.

I worry if I go that far Keltec is going to just say I voided the warranty.
 

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Blue or even better purple lock-tite. You may have stripped the head of the screw. It's a very soft metal. If you don't want to do without it for a while, and are willing to try the fix yourself, you can call Kel-tec and ask for a couple screws to be sent to you. Some of us have actually notched the head of the screw with a dremel cutting disk, and use a flat screwdriver. The screw doesn't need to be TIGHT, just snug. Hence the use of weak lock-tite. Hope this helps.

:)
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Sorry, didn't mean that the head was stripped - the threads seem to be stripped. The head is fine and my tool turns it just fine... it just doesn't go anywhere despite being turned.
 

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It is really a standard 5/64ths (0.0781") but a 2mm (0.0787") can be forced into the fit.  If it is loose, the 5/64 will turn it ok, it is just when you apply holding torque, donot strip out the head socket.  only 10"-lbs is need (thumb and ONE finger, as close as possible to axis of rotation).  

The flat spring does put some force on it when it is less than one turn loose, just enought you can't turn with just finger, you need allen to check

Be careful if it is more than one turn loose, the firing pin will pop out.

By the time I posted I see you have already tried and the screw just spins.

I think it is only 4 turns to remove it, so if you have backed out more than 4 turns and it hasn't lifted, yes the threads are stripped and you might have a problem if you a machinest
 

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My faithful Failure To Extract kit. A 2mm hex driver (Allen wrench will also work) and a NAA finger extension (Bersa will fit without alteration).



Don’t Loctite in a bad screw, you’ll just have to put heat to it to get it out.

Wilson – who’s recommending ordering a couple of extra Buttonhead from customer service as they are soft metal and the heads will be damaged sooner or later
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I'm leaning towards just sending it to KT. I'm worried about messing it up further, and frankly I would like Keltec to provide me with a gun that works solidly and reliably. The screw goes right into the firing pin assembly - I'm nervous to actually try removing it.

As for the tool, I ended up just using a universal hex tool (once I finally found it) and it's smallest bit was a perfect fit to the head.

So if I send it to Keltec, how long would it take to turnaround? If it's under 1 month or so, I'm ok with that. I have 2 other guns for ccw (Kahr PM9 and S&W 340PD) that I know work reliably - so I can obviously carry one of them in the meantime. Even over a month is ok so long as they send me a 100% reliable gun.
 

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Removing the screw to add loctite will not void your warranty. I sent mine back to KT one time with a slot cut into the screw for a flat tip. Work on removing the screw, and call KT service Tuesday for a couple new screws, an extractor, and spring.

The screw also holds the firing pin in. Some people remove the screw with the slide on so the firing pin doesn't come out. I personally remove the slide when doing this.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I can live with that.

Will they make sure they send back something they'd be willing to carry themself?

I hope that doesn't sound rude. I've dealt with companies before (not gun manufacturers though) that just couldn't care less about their products, especially defective ones.
 

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They will change some parts and probably polish the feed ramp. They will test fire the pistol before they send it back to you.
That being said, some TLC from you would help, polishing the chamber is a good place to start.

All kind of good info here http://www.1bad69.com/keltec/index.htm
 
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