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Discussion Starter · #1 ·

i just saw these and bought four.. 2 for the KSG and 1 for the other 12ga and one as a spare

they were 20$ each.

and i figured i would give them a try.
 
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This is rather like the sci-fi guns that have lights indicating the thing is loaded and ready...or not.

I'm not sure I like the idea that my gun could telegraph that it's no longer loaded.
I'd worry that the lights would reflect and could be seen by others.

Then too, there's the possible issue with leaking batteries in my magazine tube.

It's an interesting product and idea, but sort of like an answer in search of a question.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Not sure i like it all yet. But. My thoughts were to install and try.

As i said before. The KSG needs new products to innovate. The AR-15 is a cult following and if its the only ghost gun that gets innovated. Then nothing else comes out. Thats why i am working on making bettet parts machined out of alum. And working to make things better then what they are now with it. I have fired well in excess of 2,000$ thru the KSG alone. Cheap ammo to expensive. I have gone thru the forums. And experienced the kinks with it first hand. And know it needs improvement. But as it is stock. Its a trust worthy shotgun. I just see it being better. You dont see "guys" on AR15 fourms posting. "I just bought this.... cycled a bunch of snapcaps in my basement playing COD, never fired it.... but its broke?" Mostly because they'd be laughed off the interweb. And... because all those issues where resolved 30 yrs ago. The KSG like other KelTec ideas need finished. KelTec lacks a lot of things at times. But mostly its a Aftermarket base. And instead of more stupid spikes and 50rounds carried top of it with a backpack sling and another five pounds for a hellacious muzzle brake like that of a dragons nostrils and shere weight alone makes it redonkulus to carry. It needs need parts that make it even more practical and less like a airsoft scifi gun.

To me. Having that light might indeed create issues. I haven't seen it in use yet. My initial concern is the slots on the tubes. If it activates per shot. It could illumiate inside each tube. For 20 seconds. Basically a disco party each shot. Which might not be good to have. But! It could easily tell you where that follower is in the tube seeing it?.... we'll see.

But. It also might replace the need to have a round counter integration. And instead have a means by which to merely look.

Because the KSG is bullpub. I think its akward enough to reload. But! Its the fastest 7 round reload out there. And so. It might be just an idea to put one only on the left tube. -(thats my setup. I feed off right then switch to left for reload)- switch with my thumb that way you could see the feed spot a little better. But also. It might just be useless. I dont know. Mostly because the bullpub.

I'll give it a try.
 

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Of the accessories that might add to the utility of the KSG would be some sort of internal flashlight activated by a built-in switch.
That might be best done inside a new forearm, or by some sort of "flat" light that could be mounted on the top rail.
I find that external lights mounted on the bottom rail take up too much room needed for gripping the gun.
Most shotgun lights tend to be not much more then slightly modified standard flashlights.
There's nothing that says a light has to be a round tube.

Another idea I had would be a spring-loaded butt pad to reduce felt recoil.
The 870 and Mossberg conversion kit sold by Bullpup Armory has such a pad.
In the case of the KSG it would be somewhat easier because of the easily removable stock pad.
The pad assembly would need to work around the lifter and would need to not be much longer/thicker then the Kel-Tec extended accessory pad.

An easily made accessory would be a hand loop for the forearm to act as both a pump assist handle and a guard to prevent the hand from slipping forward or back.
These have been made for other guns, and you can rather easily make one from nylon strap, but a molded plastic loop as small as possible but still large enough to allow easily slipping the hand in and out and direct mounting to the lower rail might be a good seller.

You're very right that most KSG accessories are for Range Toys and have no use in the Real World.
I can see sitting in front of a judge and jury explaining all about how you stabbed someone with the spikes on your KSG and them looking at you like your wearing a Hitler costume.

Again, an AR-15 type lever safety would be nice, if not at least a standard safety that could be either reversed or one made specifically for a left handed shooter.

The idea would be to enhance the KSG, not make it a better toy.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I intend on mounting super bright LED's into the slide. I agree. Lights do not need to be round. Vertical along the sides and possibly the bottom. The lights and forend grip will be integral into the slide. While i am at it intend on changing the over all look a bit too. And making a new top pic rail that is raised up a bit higher with QD points and possibly a off the shelf laser . -(at least for mine)-

the pistol grip and stock will be redesigned too. My thoughts with the buttstock was to use a spring coil dampener to act like a suspension. But You need a solid base to fire from. But recoil reduction does happen in a lot of other platforms and i intend to mimic some of those and give it a bit less felt recoil and a bit more reach for bigger / longer armed folk... i think a expandable stock would be easily made into it using the existing space. I am also looking at a raised cheek weld. Which is where i think i could create the framework for the expandable stock.

My goal is to not add too much more weight and to skeletonize as much as possible where possible and engineer it to be a superb strong replacement for plastic.

The slides will be first. Then the butt stock. And the final will be the pistol. My intent with the pistol is a AR15 style safety. And will use the already available trigger upgrade available made of Alum.

I want to source other companies products so when its done. It spreads the parts out between the companies already trying to make parts for the KSG. Why do i need to recreate what they already make? I am drawing my ideas from a wide range of other guns out there. From stock to custom. And intend to make it all look uniform and complete. And bad bass.
 
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Another idea I had would be a spring-loaded butt pad to reduce felt recoil.
The 870 and Mossberg conversion kit sold by Bullpup Armory has such a pad.
In the case of the KSG it would be somewhat easier because of the easily removable stock pad.
The pad assembly would need to work around the lifter and would need to not be much longer/thicker then the Kel-Tec extended accessory pad.


Have you tried the extended pad, which you refer to? Scan the forum, almost everyone using one reports a decrease in felt recoil.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I have a extened and a limb saver. I am not worried about the impact to my sholder. But you do get a lot of jump and i have seen smaller framed people firing the KSG and watched how it kicks them back. Recoil from the KSG shooting full power slugs is from that 1oz slug kicking out at a thousand miles an hr in a hurry. The physics is one thing that can't change. Ever action eaqual reaction. But if i can create a different buttstock that reduces felt or implyed recoil more then a rubber pad and or an additional rubber pad maybe that energy can be sent elsewhere or spread out.

Admittedly the stock buttstock is 2 halves and a cheap pad. More time went into how it looks then how it deals with recoil.
 
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WOW!:tu: I like this. Not only for the :quote:" Hi Stress situation." But just for shooting at night. That is a fantastic plus for me. A question I have is though how visible is it to the opposition? What aids you may also aid your opponent . Of course one should have cover or at least partial cover before approaching a possible threat anyway, but I would just like to know. I like it overall . :ty:
 

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Besides the obvious potential problem of illuminating the shotgunner, I don't see the point of this product. If I have intruders in my house and they are still "viable" after five rounds from my 12 gauge, there is something very wrong that reloading the shotgun (slow) isn't going to cure. I'll either be grabbing something else or in hell bent retreat. Probably both.

There is also the possibility that the LED follower could cause a malfunction. Shotgun followers tend to be a simple part, often one piece. The LED follower is a multi-part device. What if it came apart inside the tube? I doubt that they have been extensively test fired in a wide range of shotguns under a wide variety of conditions and loads. Since they are new, they obviously don't have a track record.

I'll pass, thank you.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
So. Here is what i have found.

The follower lights as the gun recoils. Both sides. The LED lights for "tactical disadvantage" idea is a bunch of bs... its called the real world. No. i am not souly refering to the post on here. I am also reffering to the comments from the special forces keyboard army out there on youtube.

I am not sure what the G shock factor for the activation on the follower is. But it does take a jar or good linear impact to set them off. But the sensor once excited is eaily re-excited. If that is a useable phrase....? And can seem to easily keep going. I had one blinking for a few minuets until i hit on it with a channel locks.

Once they also start blibking, they do lose their brightness. I believe its the capacitor charge cycle. Giving them time between lighting makes them bight once again.

They calaim 70,000 lights. But i would like to see the real world testing on that. Other then something they pulled out on paper. -(my classic examble is the guys who will tell you mobile equipment needs 250 gallons of hydro oil, when they do their by the book calculations)-


I would say. In a common year. If you shoot the KSG regularly. Or cycle it in your moms basement. Plan on buying a set every 6months. -(My bet.)- We'll see. I' wont count everytime it lites up. But. I'll keep track of the dates. And when it stops lighting up. Then estimate how many rounds i maybe? Shot.... or cycled thru it.

Some possible positives is that the windows on the magazine tubes will be visible from the 3-last round in the tube. However... in pitch black you have zero frame of referance anyways towards the gun. But in low light you see the window lit clearly. So. You can assume you first see it at 3 rounds. And use some rational logic and go from there.

The followers could maybe have been a little longer. To put them back in the same spot as the OEM. However. Me being me. I am going to find a way. They are designed as a one size shoe to fit the short and fat king and every peasant has to wear that shoe regardless of the size of their feet. Maybe the guy who is making them will make platform specific followers? Or.... as i already have an idea to do. When i cut one apart. I may just make a stainless follower that you cut one and put into yourself? One of the orginal ideas i had around making the round counter was to make a halleffect sensor pickup using a rare earth magnet in the followers. But maybe this could be just as fine. One thing it does do! Is it could open it up to a photo eye looking for IR? Like a remote for your TV... we'll see.

I'll take some pictures. Later.
 

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So. Here is what i have found.

The follower lights as the gun recoils. Both sides. The LED lights for "tactical disadvantage" idea is a bunch of bs... its called the real world. No. i am not souly refering to the post on here. I am also reffering to the comments from the special forces keyboard army out there on youtube.


By the time they activate (eg, you have fired your shotgun) your position has pretty much been indicated, because... you fired a shotgun.
 

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By the time they activate (eg, you have fired your shotgun) your position has pretty much been indicated, because... you fired a shotgun.
Yes, the position you fired from was revealed, but if you are moving to a new position, the shine of the LED could possibly reveal your new position. You never want to illuminate yourself unnecessarily if you are in a firefight at night.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
They're not like a giant becan. Besides. I'd hope you were already planning your next move and moving to cover and concealment anyways as soon as you pulled that trigger.
 
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Also. Keep in mind. You got no lights visiable until you are down to the 4th. To last round is ejected from the tube into the breech. And if the KSG is at your cheek. You barely can see the glow. -(i think mine are dim. Or if they are as bright as they get. Then they are just right. Its enough to barely see or drop ready and check. Lets face it. You're likely not going to fire off all seven rounds at once when you do need to use it. I know they like to train and indoctrinate people that they will be facing a horde of zombies. But likely if you drop 5 rounds -(assuming you already had one in the chamber.)- you'll still have 10 in the KSG. So your LED lights would give you a idea to confir with count as to where you do indeed sit for count.

I think in 99% of the true times. Its not going to give you away. But it may aid you as to where you sit in lower light sisuations. But. I dont know.

 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
And........ they light no more.

One kinda lights up. The other.... DOA....

Whats that? A few weeks?

Eh.... maybe they'll imporve.
I' see what go gauge says.
 

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And........ they light no more.

One kinda lights up. The other.... DOA....

Whats that? A few weeks?

Eh.... maybe they'll imporve.
I' see what go gauge says.
Thanks. Please do. I suppose there is no battery replacement correct? I am curious to as what they have to say. Yes Please keep us posted.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I sent them a email.
I am not going to write them off yet. From what i understand he's a small company. I'll give them a few trys.

They responded quickly.

The thing is. I havent really used the KSG or played with it much. After i put them in.

Today i was preping and racking a few to check and during a few boxes of slugs. We kept checking. And even after a recoil. Nothing.

The concept is sound. The batteries need improved. Or to be replaceable. There is a good idea there. And with the windows on the KSG you can see the lights right there under your eye.

Again. Its a good idea. Just needs tweeking. I dont know who they sent out for T&E or if we have the beta products. But i would test them. Hell. Kids toys from china have more battery life.

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