[haertig]

... my father-in-laws (now deceased) basement. They were literally thrown into a box with other junk. Anyone recognize them? Not that I think I'd want to shoot any of them, but maybe the airgun if I could install new seals, and maybe the .22 SA revolver (maybe!) That electrical tape on it's grip is really special.

The picture of all five: The top one is a Crosman airgun, resembling a Ruger Mark I. Next down is a SA .22 revolver. Next two are break-top revolvers. I have no idea what the caliber is - no markings on the guns that I can make sense of. The cylinder is pretty short, not a .38spl. The duller one has no markings at all, the brighter one has a few (see detailed picture at the bottom of this post). The bottom gun (?) is a weird little thing. The "magazine" looks like a stick. The muzzle looks about .22 caliber. There is no slide - it appears to be an immoveable chunk of metal. There are two holes in the top. At first, I thought it might be a cigarette lighter. But it looks to have powder residue on it, and it's pretty heavy duty for a cigarette lighter. Made in Germany. I have no idea how to check to see if the thing is loaded, so we've been handling it with care. Maybe it IS a cigarette lighter??? (I'm not going to pull the trigger to find out though!)

[edit] The 22 revolver is marked "Herter's Single Action 22 LR" [/edit]

 

[ole442]

Maybe it IS a cigarette lighter??? (I'm not going to pull the trigger to find out though!)

Funny! Neat group though.

My mother-in-law had an H&R 22 revolver when she passed away. It would only fire every other round. Once I figured out what was broken, ordered and installed the part, it works fine now. Nothing spectacular but was neat to get it to work.

 

[TxCajun]

Next gun buy back program... get those dangerous weapons off the street.

 

[haertig]

I'm sure they're quite dangerous. More so to the shooter than the target!

The last one we found in his basement had a cracked fame (a little .22 mini-revolver that fits into a belt buckle). And some ancient unlabeled black powder thing that only a suicidal fool would try to load up and shoot.

But there were some good guns there too, a Colt Diamondback .38spl in 95% condition for one (pretty much like a Python, just in .38spl not .357mag)

 

[haugrdr]

The one you think may be a lighter? Seems to be a "starter" pistol...from what I can find.

Looks like this...only yours seems older?

https://www.the-saleroom.com/en-gb/...0052/lot-e6dcdb30-eee8-44c9-8b9f-a54b00c45ff5

Video shows how ya load it and fire it and stuff.

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SKcww8FSVnc[/ame]

 

[macvs2]

Way back when, Herters had a line of revolvers they imported, both single and double action, i believe most were made by J.P.Sauer and Son. The ones I've handled were rough but fully serviceable; my hunting pard sometimes carries a Herters single action in .401Herter Magnum!
The top break is likely a .38S&W, very common in that era; if unmarked it might just be a Spanish or Belgium copy of an H&R or Iver Johnson.
bob

 

[haertig]

The one you think may be a lighter? Seems to be a "starter" pistol...from what I can find.

How in the heck did you find that??? Your internet search skills are beyond guru status! I bow to your greatness. You always seem to find a link or a reference to anything and everything. Can you teach a class on your search techniqies at a future Phideaux's event?

Yes, mine looks like that starter pistol. I think you nailed it on the head.

 

[haugrdr]

Dave...I could teach ya...but then I'd have to kill ya.

Just a lucky guess and Google. :rayof:

 

[Charley]

The revolvers are either 38 S&W, as mentioned, or perhaps 32 S&W.

 

[haertig]

The top break is likely a .38S&W, very common in that era

That sounds very likely! I looked up the .38S&W cartridge and picture of it sitting next to a .38spl appears to be about the length of the cylinders on those top-breaks. The bore does look to be about .38 caliber too.

So I'll call them .38S&W guns, not that it matters. I'm not planning on shooting them and potentially blowing myself up. The guns do not inspire confidence. They seem solid enough, but there's this nagging doubt floating in my head. I think it's a sixth sense trying to keep me alive...

 

[haugrdr]

Ignore that sixth sense...listen to your internal hillbilly.

"Hold my beer and watch this!"

 

[haertig]

The revolvers are either 38 S&W, as mentioned, or perhaps 32 S&W.

My calipers are loaned out at the moment, but I did an unofficial test: A 9mm round will snugly insert into the muzzle of the larger top-break (just the bullet, not the case), but it won't fit into the smaller top-break.

So I probably have both a .38S&W and a .32S&W.

Now that I have these things identified (kind of), it's off to the first "gun buy-back" I can find. I've got about five "I will never in my life dare to shoot this" guns. All from the father-in-law's basement. That's got to be worth something at a buy-back! They might even buy back the two air guns I found. But those are actually pretty cool, and I think I'll look around to see if I can find new seals for them first. They appear to be well made, albeit quite old. I wonder what the going rate is per gun at a buy-back? I'm probably halfway to getting a new gun by dumping this worthless junk to the anti-gunners for cash back!

 

[haertig]

Oh wait. I forgot. Buy-backs are rare in Colorado, and now I remember why. A few years back the anti-gunners managed to push through so called "universal background checks". I remember reading a newspaper article where the anti's were planning on hosting a buy-back and then melt down the guns with great fanfare. But the sheriffs shut them down because they didn't have a mechanism in place to do a background check on each and every "firearm transfer" for the buy-back junk that they planned to melt down. I remember the antis whining, "Why do we need to pay for background checks if we're just going to melt them down?" To which the sheriffs replied, "That's the law you passed, you idiots."

Funny, the Colorado sheriffs (50+ of 'em, all but one or two) have all stated they they wouldn't enforce these stupid background check laws. Except, obviously, in the case of anti-gunners trying to hold a headline-grabbing buy-back. Way to go sheriffs!

 

[guru2sum]

Way back when, Herters had a line of revolvers they imported, both single and double action, i believe most were made by J.P.Sauer and Son. The ones I've handled were rough but fully serviceable; my hunting pard sometimes carries a Herters single action in .401Herter Magnum!
bob

The Herters were imported in the 1960s and 70s. This (top one) Sauer and Son seems well made (.357 Mag.), quite comparable to the Ruger below it.



If the cylinder lines up with the bore, the .22 should be safe to fire.

 

[jonnin]

How in the heck did you find that??? Your internet search skills are beyond guru status! I bow to your greatness. You always seem to find a link or a reference to anything and everything. Can you teach a class on your search techniqies at a future Phideaux's event?

Yes, mine looks like that starter pistol. I think you nailed it on the head.

The auto complete in my google search immediately offered "starter pistol" when I asked for "german pic small pistol". Alternatively looking at a couple of pages of images for the same and doing a visual match leads right to it.

That's how I usually find the oddballs, is visual image matching with a few keywords from the gun itself.

the old nickel plated break tops .. probably a 38 S&W. Not worth much, but ppl will pay for one that still has the finish, most of them lost that long, long ago. They are known to have lost their SAO cocked ability as the spur on the hammer breaks off. If you can cock it, its worth more. Some models are DAO, though, and some are DAO because they broke.

 

[haertig]

The smaller of the two, the one I'm now assuming is .32S&W, works both DA and SA. The larger one appears to be DAO. If I had to guess, I'd say that was "by design" because I can't feel any indication that there is some part of it's internals that would hold the hammer back in SA mode. Pulling the hammer back manually is very smooth, there is no indication that something is trying to catch, but is failing. Could be something is broken, but it just doesn't feel broken, if that makes any sense. But it would be hard to tell in any case.

I appreciate all the feedback folks have given me on these guns. Not that I like them or intend to fire them or sell them. It's just fun increasing my personal knowledge. So thanks!

 

[dracer]

I always wounder how you buy back some thing you never owned

 

[fez]

I would see what a smith wants to check them out as to caliber and condition. Might be fun to shoot them. Maybe make a few more bucks then a buy back if you sell them.

 

[Mattitude]

The Crosman pellet pistol looks to be an earlier model by the design of the CO2 piercing cap and the more desirable ones have an adjustable power adjuster by way of a small screw that's above the front part of the trigger guard. I believe that if it's a .22 caliber then it's a MK I and if it's .177 then it's a MK II. If it holds air and in good condition overall the value is around 150.00 and if it leaks figure around 100.00. They are collectable and very cool air guns, I happen to have an earlier version MK II and re-sealed it myself over a year ago and I still enjoy shooting it...but I wish it was the .22 version. The .177 pistols also fire steel BB's but they really beat up the rifling in the barrel which was the case with mine.

 

[haertig]

That Crosman is a .22 caliber, and it does say "Mark I" on it. It has nice target grips on it, with a huge thumbrest on the left grip. All the other airguns I've purchased myself are .177, so I guess I'll order some of the .22 pellets next time I'm at Pyramyd Air or Amazon.

This Mark I air pistol is pretty neat, I'll admit. We found another air pistol in that basement several months ago (but it was in a different box full of junk). That other air pistol is a Crosman 38T, a .177cal revolver. I put PellGun oil on the cartridge seal for the revolver and it pressured up and shot fine. So I put in another cartridge and then just let it sit for a while to see if the seal would hold longer-term. A few hours later, the gun made a giant fart noise, much like my own "failed seal" sound, so I guess that answered my question.

The revolver is a six shot (pellets, not BB's) and the Mark I is a single shot. The metal is painted, not blued, so you can see some small chips here and there on both guns. Both are quite heavy and appear to be very well made.

Here are the two "basement finds" (the airgun part of it):