Community for Kel-Tec Shooters banner

1 - 20 of 53 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
475 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Feeding problem - FIXED!

I finally received the snap caps for my KSG and ran some through the gun. The gun will load one round and will eject the round but it fails to load another round. I need to rack one more time and it then loads the round.

The round loads properly. I pull the trigger. I rack the slide hard. The bolt goes to the rear but another round is not released from the mag tube (both sides). It appears the small catch does not move down to release the round. I then close the bolt on an empty chamber, fire and rack the slide again. This time the round is released from the mag tube and loads properly.

So, load round, fire, rack the slide, round not loaded, fire, rack the slide, round is loaded, fire.

When I first picked up the gun I put about 18-20 rounds through it with no problems. Also, the small mag catch does move down each time when I dry fire and rack without any rounds in the gun.

I have taken the gun apart several time and I replaced the mag followers with ss followers.

When I load rounds into the mag tubes it frequently takes several tries to get the round to enter the tube. It catches on the small mag catch.

Please help.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
475 Posts
Discussion Starter #2 (Edited)
Took a closer look at the gun. The sequence of operation appears to be: When you rack the slide to the rear the bolt extracts the fired shell and the lifter ejects the fired shell from the receiver while dropping into position to pick up the next shell. The CTG Outer Catch (part 331) then drops down to release the shell in the mag tube while, at the same time, the CTG Inner Catch (part 330) rises to catch the next shell in the mag tube preventing that shell from leaving the mag tube. When you rack the slide to the front the bolt loads the shell into the barrel chamber and the CTG Outer Catch (part 331) moves up to catch the next shell in the mag tube. At the same time the CTG Inner Catch moves down to release the next shell in the mag tube that is then held by the CTG Outer Catch for the next cycle.

I checked my gun and the CTG Outer Catch does not move down t release the shell on the first rack of the slide. The catch on the empty mag tube does move down while the catch on the loaded mag tube does not move down. It does on the second try and every time when the mag is empty. I need to check to see if the CTG Outer Catch is dragging on the shell case due to a sharp edge. I also need to observe the operation sequence to see if anything is out of order.

Your thoughts?

Update:

I checked the shell heads of the new snap caps I have. There are some scratches on all of the case heads. I also found that if I really slam the slide the CTG Outer Catch does not drop like it should. With the slide still in the rear most position, the CTG Outer Catch does drop if I hit the slide to the rear.

At this point, I believe that the front and rear edges of the CTG Outer Catch need to be polished and the oint of the CTG Outer Catch needs to be very slightly rounded. If this is done, the catch point will not grab the head of the shell but will slide along the shell head and require less force to move. Polishing the rear edge of the CTG Outer Catch will allow the rim of the shell to slide smoothly over the catch when reloading the mags.

So, please tear these thoughts apart or validate them. I would like to hear from you before I do this.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
535 Posts
I've never gotten good patterns nor penetration from shooting snap caps. They're are quite rounds though. Can't say they'll do much on a bad guy...even a stray dog for that matter. But to each his own in choice of ammo.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
272 Posts
Snap Caps, when used for their intended purpose, dry firing practice, work well.

However, for simulating extraction etc., they are a far cry from real ammo, and I wouldn't go off on any adventures with a file or Dremel until live ammo confirmed any percieved problems with loading, feeding, or extraction.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
475 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
CharlieB - I use the snap caps because I find the recoil much easier to handle. That nd I don't have to patch any holes in my walls. Outside, I opt for more power.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
475 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
FIXED!

My KSG now cycles the snap caps properly. You still have to rack the slide like you mean it, but the gun cycles as it should. It is now slightly easier to load the shells into the magazine.

What I did was:

The CTG Outer Catch (part 331) has a slight hook at the tip that contacts the shell head when it is holding the shell in the mag tube. That tip was very sharp and was digging into the shell head making it harder to operate causing it to hang up preventing the shell from being released as it should when the slide was racked to the rear. This was happening to both mag tubes.

I sanded and polished the tip of the CTG Outer Catch to remove the sharp tip and just slightly rounded and polished the tip. I also polished the rear edge of the CTG Outer Catch to make it easier for the catch to slide over the rim of a shell as it is loaded into the mag tube. I used 600 grit polishing paper and a piece of a Dremel cutting disk to work o the tip and polish the rear edge of the catch.

I was able to run 10 rounds of those vicious snap caps through the gun several times with NO hangups. Easy fix.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19 Posts
Snap caps do not have gun powder in them they are used for practice.

I am also having rhe same issue and came here looking to see if anyone else has done this before i try it. I called keltec after an hour and ten minutes wait time and they told me it might void warranty if parts are filed or altered. For any of you out there that live far from cocoa beach fl wherr kel tec is located then this diy might work out better for you but i live in orlando so i think ill just take the 45min drive drop it off and have a beer lunch at the beach and pick it back up on the way home. They said it would be covered under warranty and would most likely only take a few hours
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
209 Posts
am i missing something with snap caps?

I don't own any. I dry fire occasionally and work the action a few times now and then but just don't bother with snap caps.

If it worked well with LIVE ammo I'd leave it alone because what if your alterations to use snap caps now causes live ammo not to function properly in your ksg?
While I think that the vix you made wouldn't effect your firearm in any negative way and may actually aid in functioning I'd test it before i ever trusted it in any way.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
475 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
I use snap caps to test the function of my firearms. This KSG failed the function test. I believe what was happening when I used live ammo was the shock of the recoil would jolt the catch enough to allow the KSG to reload the next shell. Since there was no jolt when I used the snap caps, the KSG failed to reload the next round but the jolt of cycling the gun on the empty chamber allowed the KSG to function as it should.

This brings up the remote possibility of the KSG failing to load a shell into the chamber when a mis-fire would occur and I need to reload a new shell into the chamber by cycling the action. I also did not want to rely on the shock of the recoil to make my KSG function. I, personally, found this unacceptable.

The very little polishing and edge dulling I did will have no detrimental effect on the operation of the KSG. I don' think anyone (Kel-Tec) would even notice what I did, it's that small.

You are absolutely right is saying I need to test the KSG before I trust it for self defense. Anytime you make modifications to a gun, it should be tested.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19 Posts
Snap caps are imitation ammo that has the weight and feel of real ammo whether its 9mm or 12 gauge. Neither have gun powder in them. They will not fire. I believe your are refiring to mini shells that are roughly half the size of 3" shells. Maybe snap caps are a slang term that is used for them where you live but if you go order snap caps online or any store i know of you will not get live ammo. Hope this helps clear that up
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
475 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
I was replying, in jest, to CharlieB's post. I use 2 1/2" inert, weighted 12ga shells with rubber in place of a primer - snap caps - to dry fire and to check the operation of my KSG. The snap caps did not function in the gun so there was a problem. I fixed the problem.

You can see the snap caps here:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/321360379143
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19 Posts
Lol that was ment for charlieB and the other member. I figured you knew what they were. Im glad you figured it out and got it to work thanks for posting the results. Lots of people never take the time to post the results after they succeed. I was thinking of getting those same snap caps. So you don't recommend them then
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
475 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
I do recommend them. The price was good with fast shipping. The dealer has put a small amount of silicone sealer on the crimp to keep it in place. They work fine and helped me prove my KSG.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19 Posts
I sucked it up and just did it as well, the amount of material i took off shouldnt void warranty it lools like it could have been natually worn that way from humdreds of rounds. Here are some pics of what i did. I am in no way giving anyone permission nor telling anyone to do this. I take no responsibility for your actions. That being said it fixed my issue. Im having not failer to load and i dont have to slam nearly as hard. I filed and polished the catch levers and also on the other end of the levers where the slide ramps up on the lifter i took on a slow 9s wheel to smooth and make it slick i also took off the plate on the slide that makes contact with the catch levers and very lightly smoothed and barely rounded the sharp edge.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
475 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Nice pics. Thank you. Your pics show very clearly what needs to be done. This is pretty much what I did but I did it in the gun. I didn't take the levers out. It's a simple fix for a frustrating problem. Since I had the feeding problem and you did also, I'm sure there are others out there with the same problem. It's amazing how much just a little attention improves the operation of the KSG.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
I have a totally different issue while using the snap caps. The left tube will feed them correctly but the right tube will feed multiple shells causing a jam and it will not load a shell into the barrel. Haven't fired any live ammo through the SG. Any thoughts or input would be appreciated.:confused:
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
15,000 Posts
Take it out and shoot it...report back on what happens.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
Well finally got around to putting some live ammo through the KSG about 50 slugs and some double ought all 3" shells; anyway the right feed tube works as advertised but the left is a far different story. The left tube does not release only one shell it lets two slide out and will not feed the first released due to the other shell being in the way. Any thoughts?
 
1 - 20 of 53 Posts
Top