Failure to extract problems continue

Discussion in 'P-3AT' started by fas111, Oct 5, 2010.

  1. fas111

    fas111 New Member

    25
    Aug 28, 2010
    Hello All:
    My P-3AT is giving me fits!!! It is basically a single shot pistol. I have never had the pleasure of firing 5 rounds in a row. I called Kel-Tec and they sent me a new extractor, spring and screw-no improvement perhaps its even a little worse. Went to the range this AM to try the new extractor and out of 15 rounds had 10 FTE. I am not limp wristing I really hang on to the little bugger. Called Kel-Tec as soon as I got home and they want me to return it for service. They did not offer to pay frt until I asked which is ok with me. If you don't ask you don't get. UPS will be here in two or three days and they claim up to 8 weeks to get it back to me. How hopefull should I be that it is gonna work when I get it back?? I am losing faith. Would love to hear of your experiences in return to the factory for service-both good and bad experiences would be appreciated.
    Thanks, Frank
     
  2. JFB

    JFB New Member

    Jul 25, 2005
    do you have any one else that could try it before you send it back

    what were the symptoms. something like this ot something else
    1)is the spent case return to the chamber
    2)is the rim of the spent catching on the mouth of the next round

    do you have an extended magazine or extension?
     

  3. MphsTiger1981

    MphsTiger1981 New Member

    387
    Feb 4, 2010
    fas111,

    Two quick things. I'm sure by now you've checked the button screw on the extractor to make sure it's not working loose while you're shooting, right? Did you use green or blue loctite to help secure it? Also, if you did the fluff and buff, did you pay attention to the chamber with some fine grit sand paper or emery cloth?

    Mine did the same thing and I had KT send me a new extractor, spring and button screw. Once I replaced it and used the loctite, and rebuffed the chamber once again, my problems with FTE have seemed to resolved.

    Good luck getting this resolved. We all understand how frustrating this can be.
     
  4. JFB

    JFB New Member

    Jul 25, 2005
    as for possible limp wristing, maybe we should start calling it "Violating Newton's Third". It is not only letting the gun recoil freely, but the recoiling force must not be lost to friction or binding. that is why I recomend grease, even though I don't use it.

    be sure the recoil springs ends are not interleafed, by rotating the outer slightly once in the barrel/slide assembly

    you stated you replaced the extractor. are you sure you have an ejector in the frame? it is easliy lost and there has been reported missing from the factory

    the other thing would be to include the magazine in the clean and lube. the follower must not have any mold marks that drag in the tube. also the spring coils needs to be orented the same as follower and besure it fits on the base plate coil holder pins.
     
  5. IN_Sheepdog

    IN_Sheepdog New Member

    11
    Sep 20, 2010
    I've been having the similar problems with the extraction from the p3-AT.  They have also sent me a new extractor, in hopes of solving the FTE problems. One possibility I have found is as simple as the shape of the bullet. I was at the range on Sunday, and was firing MBI blunt nose range ammunition.

    In cursing numerous times as I fired, the fellow next to me who was also firing a .380 said why don't you try a different ammo round?  He had some of his own straight lead, round nose shells that fed through perfectly.  Although it's a little premature to judge on two magazines of nine rounds (I have the extended grip) I was surprised to see that I did not have one miss feed. It seems to me that the blunt nosed bullet tends to hang up on the front of the magazine and does not apply the pressure from underneath causing the stove pipe catching of the previous shell.  With the full rounded nose bullet it seemed to feed up the ramp much easier.

    Another thing I found that improved the feeding was to follow the "fluff and bluff" listed elsewhere here. Of particular importance is the polishing of the feed ramp into the breach. A Dremel tool with a bullet nosed felt tip and some white emery Rouge, polished it up to a mirror finish, and improved some of the feeding problems.

    I have not had the opportunity to run my actual SD rounds through it yet, but since they seem to have more of a pointed front of the bullet with the hollowpoint I am assuming that this would also act more similar to the round nose bullet than the blunt nose.  I guess I'm going to have to shoot some of the more expensive SD rounds so that I can be confident that it is going to feed dependably when necessary.

    I feel for you. It is frustrating as hell to be lined up on the target and attempt to pull the trigger only to find out you've got the previous showcasing stuck in the breach.  I have heard sending it back to Kel-Tec is not a bad option, in that it seems many of the guns when they were turned do not have the same problem. I don't know exactly what they're doing to him but that seems to be the general consensus.

    Kel-Tec needs to get on this as it is giving the gun a bit of a bad rap...  The guy next to me was shooting a Ruger LCP, and had no feed problems, however he was not using blunt nosed bullets either.

    I would be interested in others experience as well.  It appears ammunition in the small guns makes a BIG difference.  I would also like to have input as well as for now, I am having similar problems and if they dont improve, I may be sending mine back as well.

    IN_Sheepdog
     
  6. fas111

    fas111 New Member

    25
    Aug 28, 2010
    Thanks for the replys folks. I did not fluff and buff it. The fired rounds are staying in chamber completly the fresh round bumps up against it. Once I get the mag. out I sometimes have to cycle the action twice to get the extractor to pull the fired case out. The new screw did have blue locktite on it and I made sure to tighten it up. The ejector did not fall out. I am just going to let Kel-Tec deal with it.
    Thanks again
     
  7. oldgranpa

    oldgranpa New Member

    628
    Sep 23, 2004
    Maybe I missed seeing it, but what ammo were you using? Good, American made? Or foreign stuff? Big difference.

    Also, is it hard to get the spent round out of the chamber?
     
  8. fas111

    fas111 New Member

    25
    Aug 28, 2010
    I have tried 4 brands of ammo, all FMJ round nose. Magtech, Blazer Brass, Remington, and Speer Lawman. They all fail to eject no one brand seems better than the other. I assumed the breakin would be easier if I used RN rather than waste money on HPs until the thing works correctly.
    I do have to cycle the slide a couple of times before the spent round will eject. Spent round remains in the chamber and the new round strips off the mag and jams the action.
    I have carried an old Colt Cobra 38spl for many years and picked up the Kel-Tec because I wanted something smaller. One thing about the Cobra every time you pull the trigger it goes bang.
     
  9. MphsTiger1981

    MphsTiger1981 New Member

    387
    Feb 4, 2010
    Frank,

    I think I forgot to welcome you to KTOG in my original response, so please accept my belated Welcome!

    Your original post asked about experiences returning guns to the factory. My experience was overall very positive. I had a first generation P32 and was experiencing light hammer strikes. While they did keep it approximately ten weeks, when it returned it was fixed good as new. As I was not the original owner, I cannot complain about the warranty. They did all of this for free. My only costs were the shipping and the time without the gun. Hopefully, you can get yours back inside of the six to eight weeks they give as the expected turn around time and you'll never have to part with it when it comes back to you.

    Best,

    tiger.
     
  10. JFB

    JFB New Member

    Jul 25, 2005
    Frank has already recievied a special welcoming :eek:
    in his first posting, the infamaous ScottD (allias #25, SeaHawk60) was trying to make a come back and tried to pick a fight with Frank, but couldn't.  
     
  11. PshootR

    PshootR Banned

    Apr 1, 2005
    You can check if a fired case is being firmly held by the extractor. If you are right handed, while holding the stripped slide in your left hand slide a fired case up under the extractor hook with your right hand. It should grip the case until the case head exposes about half of the firing pin hole in the breach face as you slowly slide the case head down the breach face. If it does then most likely the barrel is falling so far down as it unlocks from the slide that the case head is dropping down below the extractor's hook. If the case is not being held tightly the extractor is not able to move far enough to the right under spring pressure. Since cutting the extractor groove in the slide deeper is not very practical the only cure is to remove material from the inside of the extract behind the hook, in effect making the hook longer.
     
  12. fas111

    fas111 New Member

    25
    Aug 28, 2010
    Well UPS showed up yesterday and KT will receive the little bugger today. The wait begins. Hopefully in a couple of months I'll be able to tell you guys how well it works.
     
  13. JFB

    JFB New Member

    Jul 25, 2005
    I know things feel bad right now, the only thing I can suggest is to immedialy got to a gun store and buy something (a nice used High Standard 22 or a 44 wheel gun). After being off the wagon for 30 years and to have a disappointment like this could scar you for life ;D
     
  14. fas111

    fas111 New Member

    25
    Aug 28, 2010
    Hey JFB:
    In anticipation of the KT acting up I did bring along my 40 year old Ruger MK1 bull bbl to the range. After attempting to shoot the KT I got the Ruger going. Had a blast and it shoots as good as it ever did. I used it and a Hi-Standard Victor in comp. with the Orange County Pistol League. We used the USMA indoor range at West Point. That was really the good old days!! By the way I still have the Victor too.
     
  15. JFB

    JFB New Member

    Jul 25, 2005
    you may have caught I didnot recomend buying a new ruger, since the chances are you would have to work the bugs out of it to perform to what you might have remembered.

    Glad to here you still have Ruger and HS.  good fun shooting and cheap.

    I recently "found" my HS Sport King (there is an old post about me looking for it) and my big disappointment with it is that when plinking, I have to keep looking for "new" targets, since first hits destroy them.  right now sweet gum balls are plentiful  ;D

    Orange County? I sometimes go to Roseton to work. really nice country and folks around there (once out of Newburgh)