[Packer]

  RVAJoe has PMd me with a question. I'm going to answer it, but I feel that these are some good questions that should be shared with the rest of the forum.

  So, Joe, this is how you would address something different without hijacking somebody's thread: You start a new thread with that new topic.

"Is this something (breaking of firing pin after chewing up extractor retaining screw) that is specific to the P3at?  I hope it is ok that I ask this outside the post - I felt like I might be getting away from the original intention of the thread - let me know.  

I have been into guns for awhile, I shot my first with my dad 28 years ago, bought my first 8 or so years ago, but I"m not much of a gunsmith.  I can break down my guns etc. but I guess I"m worried that I got myself into a can of worms with a p3at as a carry gun.  For example, I just read a thread about the recoil spring shooting out of the front of the slide on guns very near in serial number as my J5P2X parked p3 and even though I looked up "peening" I am not sure that I know exactly what to look for.  

Is the P3at a gun that is only for folks who can work on them with great detail, like an VW van or a classic muscle car that is great as long as you know how to take the engine out and replace the carb?  

Long story short - I am new to message boards and you have been helpful in answering my questions on the board but if this PM is too much just let me know.  

Thanks in any case,

Joe in Richmond."

 

[Packer]

  Joe, to answer your specific question about the dry-firing: When you dry fire, the firing pin (that would be stopped by the primer) slams into the firing pin retaining screw. This is a picture of a FP retaining screw that has experienced 2 dry fires:

  If you multiply that slight damage by hundreds of dry fires, the damage would be intense. The FP retaining screw on older models is soft and it will go before the firing pin. However, the new screws are harder. This screw could either crack and break off, or it could be hard enough to break the firing pin.

  For whatever reason, if the bottom of the FP retaining screw is worn or broken off, you run the risk of the firing pin shooting out the back of a weapon that has your EYE lined up right behind it.

  As far as gun smithing goes: Some of us here like to do our own work. It's not NECESSARY to do so though. Your factory warranty allows you to send your pistol to the factory any time you have a problem. They will always make it right. Chances are though that you will be one of the vast number of KT owners who NEVER have a problem.

Packer.

 

[z71bill]

GUNSMITH - thats how I feel after my HORRIBLE shooting range trip yesterday.

I sent my P-3AT off to KT - finally gave up on it - yesterday had 4 failures in 24 rounds - that was the last straw.

Called Kahr about my PM9 problem - had a jam yesterday that really bothered me. Cartridge wedged into ramp. The service guy said it sounded like I may have a feed ramp problem - so he is sending me a new barrel - he said he would polish the ramp before he mailed it - so it will "look like a mirror" - plus a new recoil rod & spring that is 1 pound heavier.

Called Hi-Point about my 40 caliber carbine jams - after explaining my issue we decided it must be the magazine - so they are sending me a couple new ones to try.

That leaves the M&P 40 - one minor fail to feed - that was not to hard to clear. S&W rep thought it could have been an ammo related problem. Winchester flat nose target rounds - he offered to look at it - if I would send it in - I decided to give it one more chance - before I do.

So out of 4 guns taken to the range - all had at least one failure.

I am happy with the service provided by all 4 companies - but if this luck continues (if I did not have bad luck I would have no luck at all) I may need to go to night school to become a gunsmith!

 

[adamsesq]

I just wish this thread would be remembered when I hear (on other forums...) about how "KTs can't be relied on, cheap", etc. and how "if I spend $ on a gun it ought to be 100% ought of the box forever even if I never clean it or do anything to it..."

I, oh I mean my friend, has even had failures on a glock. Sacriledge!

-Scott

 

[lonewatchman]

Yesterday I went to the range with a brand new P3AT fired 50 rounds of American Eagle with no problems at all. Even let a couple of my not so experianced buddies fire it and it was again flawless. When I had my pistol on lay-away I started reading this board and I was afraid I would not be happy with my purchase. But it's important to remember people only seek advice when they have a problem so this board is going to be slanted toward people have problems since the people that don't have problems tend not to have as much motivation to post. Anyway when I first took my P3AT out of the box I tried to manually run some rounds through it and I noticed that if I did not release the slide at just the right time, a round would hold the slide back sitting half way in the chamber. A few days later I bought a magazine extention which means the spring in the mag gets replaced. I have not had any problems getting the rounds into the chamber or out of the chamber since I swapped springs. Has anyone else suspected that it may just be a cheesy spring in the factory mag that makes feeding difficult and not so much needing a fluff and buff. Perhaps the F&B just compensates for the weak mag spring so it appears the F&B is the correct fix. I just wondered what others thought of my theory, and I also want people looking at a P3AT to know they are very good weapons and despite what people are running into on this board, these pistols are not cursed.

 

[Packer]

  Welcome to KTOG, lw! That was a very nice first post.

  However, I must take issue with calling the top-quality Mecgar P3AT magazine "cheesy." Wait 'til you have something like a PF9 magazine to compare it to and you'll realize that Mecgar is the "Cadillac" of mags.''

  The reason that the new mag doesn't seem to chamber well is the stiff spring that needs breaking in just like every other gun part.

Packer.

 

[cclem700]

  Welcome to KTOG, lw! That was a very nice first post.

  However, I must take issue with calling the top-quality Mecgar P3AT magazine "cheesy." Wait 'til you have something like a PF9 magazine to compare it to and you'll realize that Mecgar is the "Cadilac" of mags.''

  The reason that the new mag doesn't seem to chamber well is the stiff spring that needs breaking in just like every other gun part.

Packer.

I agree 1000% ;D
I just wish Mec would make a sigma mag >
I have always tried to find a mec mag for ANY pistol I have ever owned and they usually do. They aren't cheap, but for what you get, it's money well spent

 

[Guest]

I just wish this thread would be remembered when I hear (on other forums...) about how "KTs can't be relied on, cheap", etc. and how "if I spend $ on a gun it ought to be 100% ought of the box forever even if I never clean it or do anything to it..."

I, oh I mean my friend, has even had failures on a glock.  Sacriledge!

-Scott

yup glocks can give problems. Also over a million glocks out there to...

 

[rjhauser]

z71bill, why not go to at least a couple of armorers schools?

rjhauser - been there, done that, got the t-shirt for the one he admits to...

 

[Rubb]

I've had to send back guns to 3 companies, all had FTE problems and all where flawless upon return.

Kel-Tec
Ruger
Para Ord

 

[rjhauser]

Kel-Tec
Ruger
Taurus
S&W
Glock

I think we all have at one point or another if you shoot enough.....

unless you are rcomdel, and forget more than I can ever know..... ;D

 

[Badman400]

Hey guys. Thought I'd chime in on this one. Yes I did send my P3AT in recently. But yes, I have also sent in others in the past year or so, including a Taurus, Beretta, Hi-Point. I have 5 other Kel-Tecs though, and none of them have ever been sent in for repair. Have I worked on them? Yes, I've done some fluff and buff and changed some springs, mostly maintenance sort of stuff. In a lot of instances the light work was easier and quicker than sending it in to be repaired.

Do you have to be a gunsmith? No. Would it help? Sure. If you're a mechanic you save money by doing maintenance on your car, like oil changes and tune-ups. The P3AT is pushing the limit, on the borderline between power and size, and as a result may be a little more prone to problems.  But in my opinion, the fact that so many own P3AT's that work well, tells me that it's worth the extra effort to have a powerful, but small, pocket rocket.  8)

 

[Packer]

  Wow, Joe! This is turning out to be a really nice thread. I hope you like the replies that you are getting. Thanks for asking this question.

Packer.

 

[lonewatchman]

It's the new (actually modified) mag that chambers better, because of the stiffer spring. That is why I wonder if people have less problems if they upgrade their mag.

 

[Guest]

Yeah Packer, thanks for posting it.

Lonewatchman - that makes a lot of sense, people not having problems don't complain. Thanks for the insight.

z71bill - man that is some bad luck. You did have one good piece of luck though, when I called Kahr for a simliar problem then wanted me to send the barrel to them. Good luck getting your guns fixed and buy a lottery ticket ;D


So far my P3at has performed well, the stiffness it almost gone and the springs don't appear to be gouging the slide. I guess I was just having some minor buyers regret after readign about so many problems. Hopefully my luck will continue. BTW, I'm loving the Nemisis (wish I had one when I had the PM9), and my extra mag and extension are in the mail. I'll post another range report next week after put another 100-150 through my new pocket rocket.

Thanks all.

Joe

 

[z71bill]

RVAJoe

I was a little surprised when the Kahr service rep said - sounds like a ramp problem - I will send you a new barrel - (they want me to send them my old barrel when I get the new one).

My guess - this may be a known problem - and this is the best solution - costs them less than having the whole gun sent in - plus they make the customer feel very good.


Sort of like the time I was traveling - HORRIBLE flight - delayed for hours - by the time I got to the car rental place I must have looked like crap.

The agent says to me - looks like you have had a hard day - how would you like a free upgrade - take you pick - Towncar or Mustang convertible - made me feel great - (I took the Towncar - it was cold and snowing) - as I was waiting for my paperwork another customer comes up and asks - do you have any cars available? The other agent says - all we have left are Towncars and Mustang convertibles!

 

[Guest]

now that is funny and I don't care who u are ;D

 

[Guest]

all we have left are Towncars and Mustang convertibles! --- ;D too funny.
When my wife and I arrived in St. Thomas for our honeymoon Christmas night 2002 we went to pick up our Ford focus and were told that they were out so we couldn't get one - all they had left were Jeep Wranglers... no problem

Yeah, that is a known problem with the PM9, there was a recall a while back. Seriously though, I probably would have kept the Kahr if they had sent me the barrel. Just so y'all know, I got a good price for it from a friend who knew 100% what he was getting. I don't regret it though, I was able to turn one pM9 into a p3 and a subbie (well almost, I had to throw another $150 at the deal). Hopefully the new barrel works for you, the PM9 is a cool little 9.