Community for Kel-Tec Shooters banner

1 - 20 of 24 Posts

Registered
Joined
173 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Something I was researching reminded me of one of the most bizarre shooting tales I have ever read. Many years ago, when I was living in Texas, I read an article about a landowner that caught a belligerant trespasser on his land. The landowner, being a true Texan, drew his single action Colt and fired a shot into the ground between the two men. As he told the police his .45 single action "went full automatic at the shot and the subsequent rounds walked themselves up into the body of the trespasser" killing him. I thought that was the most rediculous thing I'd ever read. Luckily for the landowner, the police had their ballistic people check out the gun in question and guess what? It WOULD go full auto upon firing a round!!!!!!

I could not imagine a scenario where this could possibly happen until I read the details in the article. The Colt had a hammer mounted firing pin. The firing pin was chipped so that it had a sharp point on the tip. Upon squeezing the trigger, the defective firing pin would fall and both detonate the cartridge primer AND pierce it. The resultant blow-back of gas was channeled back through the firing pin hole in the recoil shield with sufficient force to push the hammer back to full cock position which aalso rotated the cylinder to the next cartridge. Since this action happened so fast, the trigger finger still had the trigger depressed so the hammer fell again repeating the cycle until the gun was empty. It happened so fast and unexpectedly that the shooter didn't have time to release the trigger. The landowner was cleared of murder charges. I have also read of the same thing happening to another single action in Oklahoma for the same reason. Also, I have read of missing recoil shields or greatly worn out firing pin holes doing the same thing as well.

Anyone else have any true tales of bizarre malfunctions such as this one?
馃槰
 

Premium Member
Joined
4,839 Posts
Something I was researching reminded me of one of the most bizarre shooting tales I have ever read. Many years ago, when I was living in Texas, I read an article about a landowner that caught a belligerant trespasser on his land. The landowner, being a true Texan, drew his single action Colt and fired a shot into the ground between the two men. As he told the police his .45 single action "went full automatic at the shot and the subsequent rounds walked themselves up into the body of the trespasser" killing him. I thought that was the most rediculous thing I'd ever read. Luckily for the landowner, the police had their ballistic people check out the gun in question and guess what? It WOULD go full auto upon firing a round!!!!!!

I could not imagine a scenario where this could possibly happen until I read the details in the article. The Colt had a hammer mounted firing pin. The firing pin was chipped so that it had a sharp point on the tip. Upon squeezing the trigger, the defective firing pin would fall and both detonate the cartridge primer AND pierce it. The resultant blow-back of gas was channeled back through the firing pin hole in the recoil shield with sufficient force to push the hammer back to full cock position which aalso rotated the cylinder to the next cartridge. Since this action happened so fast, the trigger finger still had the trigger depressed so the hammer fell again repeating the cycle until the gun was empty. It happened so fast and unexpectedly that the shooter didn't have time to release the trigger. The landowner was cleared of murder charges. I have also read of the same thing happening to another single action in Oklahoma for the same reason. Also, I have read of missing recoil shields or greatly worn out firing pin holes doing the same thing as well.

Anyone else have any true tales of bizarre malfunctions such as this one?
馃槰
I'd love to see mythbusters try to replicate this.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
 

Registered
Joined
8,671 Posts
Do not try this at home. The BATF would not like it.

Seriously, I find it difficult to understand why someone would not have figured this out a hundred & 20 years ago.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 850sub

Premium Member
Joined
4,839 Posts
Do not try this at home. The BATF would not like it.

Seriously, I find it difficult to understand why someone would not have figured this out a hundred & 20 years ago.
My recollection is that mythbusters either had, or worked with someone who did, an SOT.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
 
  • Like
Reactions: RAT76

Registered
Joined
9,432 Posts
I've always loved the way guns in western movies just never run out of blammo. If I ever did a spoof western (I won't) at some point it would have someone shooting two six shooters and just keep shooting them, and shooting them, then just have them go into full auto ratttt a tattt tattt mode.

I figured, when I started reading this, that the issue was chain fire. The blast from one cylinder was enough to set off it's neighbor. That was an issue with black powder guns. That's why they put grease over the top of the boolet, to keep out any spark (and lube the pipe a bit).

lop
 

Registered
Joined
81 Posts
I dont know about that story but a gunsmith I knew many years ago had a SAA come in and the owner said it go's full auto. Smith said bullsh!!!! Well so he loads 2 rounds steps outside cocks it and fires 2 rounds at a high rate of fire. I understanding was the look on his face was very funny. Here is how it happened I know as I helped fig it out. this colt was old fixed firing pin.
1. the firing pin bushing was gone.
2. the rounds were reloaded a unknown number of times plus most of the flash holes were drilled out for use with wax bullets.

so when a round was fired the primer was ejected out the back recocking the hammer and as the trigger was still down hammer dropped firing the next round.
 

Registered
Joined
150 Posts
I wondered how easy it would be for an SOT to convert a Mateba, you know, for reasons...
Could be done without blowing or spitting primers.
 

Registered
Joined
173 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I dont know about that story but a gunsmith I knew many years ago had a SAA come in and the owner said it go's full auto. Smith said bullsh!!!! Well so he loads 2 rounds steps outside cocks it and fires 2 rounds at a high rate of fire. I understanding was the look on his face was very funny. Here is how it happened I know as I helped fig it out. this colt was old fixed firing pin.
1. the firing pin bushing was gone.
2. the rounds were reloaded a unknown number of times plus most of the flash holes were drilled out for use with wax bullets.

so when a round was fired the primer was ejected out the back recocking the hammer and as the trigger was still down hammer dropped firing the next round.
Absolutely! That has to be scary. I have heard of very worn and/or abused 1911's going full auto, but didn't intially think it would be possible with a single action - but it certainly is possible.
 

Registered
Joined
12 Posts
Something I was researching reminded me of one of the most bizarre shooting tales I have ever read. Many years ago, when I was living in Texas, I read an article about a landowner that caught a belligerant trespasser on his land. The landowner, being a true Texan, drew his single action Colt and fired a shot into the ground between the two men. As he told the police his .45 single action "went full automatic at the shot and the subsequent rounds walked themselves up into the body of the trespasser" killing him. I thought that was the most rediculous thing I'd ever read. Luckily for the landowner, the police had their ballistic people check out the gun in question and guess what? It WOULD go full auto upon firing a round!!!!!!

I could not imagine a scenario where this could possibly happen until I read the details in the article. The Colt had a hammer mounted firing pin. The firing pin was chipped so that it had a sharp point on the tip. Upon squeezing the trigger, the defective firing pin would fall and both detonate the cartridge primer AND pierce it. The resultant blow-back of gas was channeled back through the firing pin hole in the recoil shield with sufficient force to push the hammer back to full cock position which aalso rotated the cylinder to the next cartridge. Since this action happened so fast, the trigger finger still had the trigger depressed so the hammer fell again repeating the cycle until the gun was empty. It happened so fast and unexpectedly that the shooter didn't have time to release the trigger. The landowner was cleared of murder charges. I have also read of the same thing happening to another single action in Oklahoma for the same reason. Also, I have read of missing recoil shields or greatly worn out firing pin holes doing the same thing as well.

Anyone else have any true tales of bizarre malfunctions such as this one?
馃槰
If that was now a day's they would imprison him for having a full auto gun even though he didn't purposely make it that way. I've read articles about people getting into trouble when a firearm malfunctions going full auto
 

Premium Member
Joined
4,839 Posts
If that was now a day's they would imprison him for having a full auto gun even though he didn't purposely make it that way. I've read articles about people getting into trouble when a firearm malfunctions going full auto
So far I've only found one case and that is dramatically misrepresented in the pro-firearms community. The rest is apocryphal stories that don't track back to verifiable events.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
 

Registered
Joined
12 Posts
So far I've only found one case and that is dramatically misrepresented in the pro-firearms community. The rest is apocryphal stories that don't track back to verifiable events.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
That's good to know. I read about it happening a long time ago but I guess it's not entirely true
 

Premium Member
Joined
4,839 Posts
That's good to know. I read about it happening a long time ago but I guess it's not entirely true
There was a guy with an AR who claimed he had a runaway malfunction that triple and the ATF arrested and charged him. But his AR had a 3-position selector switch and he was bragging about how he had a machine gun. Naturally, the gun community ignored the later part and focused on the former.

Peace favor your word,
Kirk
 
  • Like
Reactions: dred

Registered
Joined
834 Posts
That's bizarre. When I read the subject I told myself, "BS!".

Full auto... Well, not really, just a "bump stock"... I was testing some ammo and sighting in a 9mm PCC and must have had conditions just right with forward pressure on the bag. I touched off a round and had a mess follow right behind. I've tried to duplicate it, unsuccessfully.
 

Premium Member
Joined
4,839 Posts
That's bizarre. When I read the subject I told myself, "BS!".

Full auto... Well, not really, just a "bump stock"...
Not really. The trigger does not have to be reset. If the trigger remains squeezed, if the hammer comes back and is let go again, there is nothing preventing it from hitting the primer. If the primer pierces and blows sufficient pressure back through the firing pin channel to force the hammer back, it repeats. This is exactly like "fanning" the gun, only using vented gasses to do it. Kinda like a gas-operated simple blowback and with no sear reset.

I think it would only work with traditional revolvers that have a SA function. If the revolver has a transfer bar/plate then that would block the gas. There has to b e a firing pin channel in the rear of the frame, and a hammer mounted firing pin.

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
 

Registered
Joined
8,671 Posts
Wonder why this isn't an issue with cap & ball. Explosive powder vs fast burn smokeless?
 
  • Like
Reactions: ral357

Premium Member
Joined
4,839 Posts
Wonder why this isn't an issue with cap & ball. Explosive powder vs fast burn smokeless?
I dunno. Maybe the angle of the flashhole? Nah, that doesn't sound right. Pressure maybe? How often do BP revolvers blow off the caps with any force?

Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
 
1 - 20 of 24 Posts
Top