Assembly Pin Spring

Discussion in 'P-3AT' started by gvaldeg1, Mar 4, 2008.

  1. gvaldeg1

    gvaldeg1 New Member

    152
    Feb 8, 2008
    Some of the posts in here make it sound like a real problem if the assembly pin spring slips out of its "notch" in the frame and gets caught between the frame and grip.  The disassembly instructions instruct and depict two fingers pressing down on the grip while prying the assembly pin free with a cartridge case.  It's easy to see how the "drag" from the assembly pin would tend to bow the grip away from the frame allowing the assembly pin spring to drop into the space between the frame and grip.  This is clearly another Kel-Tec design problem.  I didn't know this was a problem until I saw it mentioned in this forum.  It hasn't happened to me yet but someone in here said it took them about an hour to get the spring back into place.  Has this happened to a lot of P3AT owners?  Does anyone have any good suggestion about getting it back in place?  If it were easy to separate the frame from the grip it looks like it would be a piece of cake but I imagine it takes special tools to separate the frame from the grip.  How about it?  Anyone have a simple way to get the spring back into place.  I know that someone suggested using rubber-jawed vise grips to clamp the grip to the frame so that there's no space for the spring to drop free but really, should this be necessary for simple disassembly of a gun?  Anyway, I'd appreciate your thoughts on this.
     
  2. Sangueffusor

    Sangueffusor New Member

    May 13, 2007
    Indiana
    I have never once had it happen to me.

    All it takes is a punch and hammer to remove the frame from the grip.
     

  3. JFB

    JFB New Member

    Jul 25, 2005
    Due to needing to see the gun disassembled to answer questions here, I pop that pin more than a couple times a day (my method being discribe several times) and don't apply side pressure.  BUT I do understand the static and dynamic forces envolved with the arrangement and I have [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmYDgncMhXw]"The Knack"[/ame] ;)

    All manufactured products are a design COMPROMISE process.  I would think there main desire was weight and size.  they could have made the grip out of another material or even thicker to make it more robust so some one could use a crowbar to pop the pin.  Besides the "design" of the grip, other factors that may make some more prone, could be the envoroment the gun is carried, the batch composition of the grip material, the mold tolerances, and the manufacturing tolerances of the pin itself.
     
  4. TxCajun

    TxCajun Administrator Staff Member Supporter

    Sep 7, 2004
    Texas
    It's not terribly common and is easily avoided. It's simple. Don't just yank the pin out. Follow the directions in the owners manual and keep pressure around the pin when removing. You won't have a problem.
     
  5. artimus_prime

    artimus_prime New Member

    Nov 18, 2007
    Central FL
    To get the assembly pin back into place, the grip and frame do not need to be separated. Trust me, I've had to do it once or twice. You can use a flathead screwdriver to push the pin back into place while putting pressure on the grip. Vice grips would do nicely. Using a heat gun, or the girlfriends hairdryer, heat that side of the grip until the bowing goes away and the assembly pin stays put. Now you should be back in business. From here on out, use pressure on the grip on both sides of the assembly pin so you don't have to do this again! :)
     
  6. boatnsc

    boatnsc New Member

    133
    Sep 22, 2007
    l struggled with this pin replacement until l saw a video on reassembling the p3at somewhere and have experienced no problems since that time .. As l recall ,the pin is inserted at an upward angle into the pin hole over the spring then straightened out and pushed in as the barrel is jiggled a little bit,

    Hmmm... being Bike Week in the big race town, jiggling seemed to come to mind!!!!
     
  7. artimus_prime

    artimus_prime New Member

    Nov 18, 2007
    Central FL
    I'll be there Thursday! :D
     
  8. gvaldeg1

    gvaldeg1 New Member

    152
    Feb 8, 2008
    Thanks for all the comments. It's clear that the best thing to do is AVOID this from happening. Working the pin spring back in place with a "small" screwdriver sounds like a somewhat hit-or-miss proposition and, at least, a tedious one. Also, I watched the "knack" video. It's cute. However, I do understand "design compromises". I am a retired engineer. Anyway, thanks again for all of the posts. The people in here are super.
     
  9. TJB63

    TJB63 Member

    48
    Feb 25, 2008
    Dumb Question

    But is there a problem if the spring bulges the slide out or is it just a cosmetic thing? Like if the Frame is bulged, is the Slide gonna separate from the Frame upon firing or anything other crazy things?

    I ask cause it looks like I caused mine to bulged out, But if it's not a Safety issue it really dosen't bother me that much and I would just fix it the next time I'm cleaning it. But if it's something I need to fix before firing it again, I'll get right on it.

    I'd say if it creates a problem, they need to come up with a better design.
     
  10. JFB

    JFB New Member

    Jul 25, 2005

    IF, the hair pin spring has moved far enough from its position and it does NOT retain the assembly pin, you have a problem.
    Given how thin the sides of the frame are that the pin fits into, IF the pin can be pulled out a little bit more than normal, the impact forces will increase greatly due to reduce frame surface area the pin is in (the far side hole);)

    If you would like to inform KT
    M-F 8am-4pm EST
    Toll free 1-800-515-9983
     
  11. gvaldeg1

    gvaldeg1 New Member

    152
    Feb 8, 2008
    I could be wrong but I think we have a nomenclature problem here.  The frame is machined out of aluminum (210 on your parts diagram).  I'm sure that you're not "bulging" either the frame or the slide (the slide is 4140 steel).  What I suspect is, that you caused the grip (which is polymer/plastic) to bulge out near the assembly pin hole.  If your assembly pin is "clicking" into place you should be OK from a safety standpoint.  As specified elsewhere in this forum, the grip bulge can be fixed by the application of pressure and heat (like from a hairdryer).
     
  12. TJB63

    TJB63 Member

    48
    Feb 25, 2008
    Thanks Guys for the quick replys

    It appears all's well with my Kel-Tec as the pin seems to be as snug asa bug. I suppose it may be a point to watch out for while I'm shooting just to be on the safe side.

    You are right, I was talking the Plastic Grip near the take down pin that the steeol frame would sit into, thanks for keeping me on my toes.

    TJB
     
  13. boatnsc

    boatnsc New Member

    133
    Sep 22, 2007
    Having the luxury of scooting down to KT on other matters ,the helpful young lady Arienna told me that the spring sits in a depression inside the grip and if it is not seated in there you can pop the pin while firing . maybe inset is a better word and thats why the grip bulges out... or are we all saying the same thing just semantics...Some very slight peening resulted in a new HC slide and barrel being replaced by KT service and some slide damage on the PF9 l happened to have with me was upgraded to the G frame with the roll pin being blocked now resulting in no more walking...Hurray for great KT service


    P.S. Anytime you send a weapon back to KT, and want any accessories they can be shipped back in the same box on their ticket saving you shipping

    P.S.S Also told that any MODS will violate warranty .  F@B not included l would imagine trigger mods etc...she had not heard about the trinium sites coming on line yet..and admitted that Ktoggers seem to know more about whats going on at KT then the employees..Gracious service with big smiles  :) :) :)
     
  14. gvaldeg1

    gvaldeg1 New Member

    152
    Feb 8, 2008
    Just for general information, the Ruger LCP (Light Copy Pistol) assembly pin spring looks just like the one on the P3ATs. So, if nothing else, it looks like the Ruger engineers approved the same design.