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Old 08-19-2012, 02:50 AM   #1
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Default Liberty Ammunition Tested Today

A NRA instructor I know recommended some Liberty Ammunition "Halo Points". They are lead free and the entire bullet is hollow. It's primary purpose is being frangible and to keep down collateral damage since a full metal jacket can penetrate multiple layers of walls. Anyway, Liberty Ammo recommends to shoot their "Halo Points" out of +P rated guns. The PF-9 can shoot it sparingly. I decided to cycle a few magazines to see if it's something I would keep loaded.

My experience:

This sh!t is AWESOME! My brother in-law was watching and seen the crazy muzzle flash. I definitely noticed less felt recoil which is due to the 50 grain bullet. It was extremely accurate. Very pleased and it is worth the dollar/round. My PF-9 use to carry the Federal HST 147 grain... it has been replaced with Halo Points. My PF-9 is now less weight to carry.

Only issue I have with this ammo is, I paid over $30 including shipping for 20 rounds. I thought it was going to be at least 25 rounds. The website doesn't state how many cartridges your getting...

BUT... They did send me a Liberty Ammunition beer coozie! lol

I'm def. purchasing a bunch more, stocking up before the presidential election...

*FYI, Not affiliated w/ Liberty Ammunition. I was skeptical when I had originally purchased.

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Old 08-19-2012, 01:48 PM   #2
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Does anyone have a good hand load recipe for the the PF9?

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Old 08-19-2012, 09:58 PM   #3
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Sounds like MagSafe ammo, which I've tried in a .38 revolver. This lightweight fragmented ammo is a lot of bang as JSRP describes the Liberty ammo. Got no idea as to any advantages in ballistics though. Very pricey.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/product/49056

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Old 08-19-2012, 10:41 PM   #4
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I took a look at the Liberty website to review their claims for this ammo, especially the penetration tests of ballistic gel shown on the site. One thing I noted is that while Liberty claims fairly good penetration statistics, the pictures shown do not seem to back up the claim. The ballistic gel pics indicate that this ammo makes a fairly large, but also fairly shallow large entry wound, but that only fragments penetrate beyond the first few inches. This result is pretty much in line with previous types of fragmenting ammo, such as magsafe, etc. That is, it delivers wide spread, but shallow damage. I wonder though whether it can reliably penetrate to vitals however. Would have to see a lot more positive testing results before I would be willing to give it a try, espcially in view of the cost.

Jim R

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Old 08-19-2012, 11:30 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PF9Newbie View Post
The ballistic gel pics indicate that this ammo makes a fairly large, but also fairly shallow large entry wound, but that only fragments penetrate beyond the first few inches. This result is pretty much in line with previous types of fragmenting ammo, such as magsafe, etc.
Despite the gel tests, isn't that the whole idea of frangible ammo? Just sayin', it is what it is.

In my .38 there was never a round as loud with as much muzzle flash as MagSafe. I finally settled on 158gr JHP's or Hornady SD's in that gun, although if I had to shoot at someone with the MagSafe ammo, they'd think it was a 357.
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Old 08-20-2012, 12:36 AM   #6
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Despite the gel tests, isn't that the whole idea of frangible ammo? Just sayin', it is what it is.

.

To some extent, I think that is so, but there also has to be sufficient penetration to reach the attackers vitals. Otherwise, I would think all you would get is a flesh wound, not likely to stop the attack. It is pretty tough job to reach the right balance of frangibility and still get sufficient penetration and so far I have not seen any evidence that this new ammo reaches that goal. May be that there just has not been enough time and real world experience to judge yet. In the meantime, I will stick to my proven Gold Dots.

Jim R
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Old 08-20-2012, 12:46 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PF9Newbie View Post
I took a look at the Liberty website to review their claims for this ammo, especially the penetration tests of ballistic gel shown on the site. One thing I noted is that while Liberty claims fairly good penetration statistics, the pictures shown do not seem to back up the claim. The ballistic gel pics indicate that this ammo makes a fairly large, but also fairly shallow large entry wound, but that only fragments penetrate beyond the first few inches. This result is pretty much in line with previous types of fragmenting ammo, such as magsafe, etc. That is, it delivers wide spread, but shallow damage. I wonder though whether it can reliably penetrate to vitals however. Would have to see a lot more positive testing results before I would be willing to give it a try, espcially in view of the cost.

Jim R
You did notice that the velocity speed is much greater right? It is indeed +P rated, had some wicked mussel flash. Yes it will fragment into several pieces which will cause multiple wound channels. It def. would be reliable in penetrating vitals. For 6 rounds of Magsafe, it's 15 bucks... I spent 30 bucks on 20 rounds so Liberty Ammunition is a better deal (plus beer coozie lol).

I would hate to be shot with one of these. I have 1 year old in the house and do not wish for bullets to go through multiple layers of walls if something ever happened.

Like I mentioned before, I was recommended these by an NRA instructor who was a sniper for the airforce.
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Old 08-20-2012, 12:58 AM   #8
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Deleted, pointless arguing...

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Old 08-20-2012, 01:24 AM   #9
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Full metal jackets will go THROUGH a person and a few walls... Most hollow points will go THROUGH a person... Reason why I want frangible ammo loaded to keep collateral damage minimal. Imagine shooting through an attacker and accidentally hitting an innocent person. Not cool.

LEO's have shot 9mm hollow points through windshields... They have also shot them through the trunk, back seat, and the driver seat nailing the bad guy.

The website states "achieves 12 inches of penetration and a permanent wound cavity greater than 5 inches in diameter" (ballistics gel). Find a ruler and see if your body is greater than 12 inches. A persons vital organs is only at most 4-6 inches.
No question FMJ will penetrate more than a few standard house walls, even after hitting a perp. That is why it is most definitely not recommended as a self defense load. A standard JHP load, not so much (though of course, it can happen). I would agree with you that frangible ammo has its place, I am just not sure that this new ammo (despite what the maker claims) has any real world testing to back the claims up. I would like to see at least testing on cow or hog cadavers for instance, not just ballistic gel. Not to say it is not right for you and your concerns, just that I am not seeing enough evidence of any superiority. Of course, I personally do not like, nor would I use +P ammo in either of my PF-9s (actually, in any of my handguns) in any case so I guess for me its a moot point.

Jim R
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